How Much Money Did You Spend This Generation?

[ThaMaskedGamer]

One great thing about the XBOX Hardrive, it really puts gaming into perspective. I needed to put some files on memory card, so I could bring my 2nd XBOX somewhere I shouldn't. Going through my HDD was really an eye opener. I have spent WAYYYYY too much money on gaming. I was ashamed after browsing all of those old saved games. I saw save games from everything from Chase Hollywood Stunt driver to the first Ghost Recon game. It really made me sick to see the sequels. Motogp, Motogp2, and the recently added Motogp3, which was one of the games I was trying to save to memory card!!

I don't what is worse the money or the time I've lost. When I look at all those and games, and realize I sat there and finished most of them, that means a minimum of 10 hours a max of who knows what maybe 60 hours or more for Morrowind!

Then I got to thinking, exactly how much money did I spend, just this generation on XBOX? First, I bought two X-BOXes, a wheel, two wireless controllers, one precision controller, an S controller, two HD AV cables, and all those games at $50 a pop. Granted I did buy two XBOX at launch and sold one for $500, and I also regularly trade in my games after I finish them, so that means my games are mostly discounted. I still wonder if I spent less than $5000.

Now, the money isn't really a problem. But when I think about the time and the money and how spending that time and money has improved myself today, I can't help but think it was all a waste. Did playing Genma Onimusha do anything to improve my life? Sure it gave me some immediate entertainment, but so what?

Maybe I'm a gaming addict, no I am a gaming addict. But this year i've done something I probably have never done since 1991-2 when I first became addicted to PC games(was always a gamer since childhood, but never addicted), I went about 2 months without playing one video game. And didn't miss it. I actually had to force myself back into gaming. And I'm finding, i'm not enjoying it the same. I'm finding that for the first time, when I have absolutely NOTHING to do but leisure activities, gaming is the last thing i'm reaching for and i'm actually forcing myself to do it.

I did the same thing with TV. Years ago, I just rejected TV and now the only thing I can watch is news and a few sports events like the NBA Playoffs or the NFL Playoffs or a big boxing match. I'm wondering, is this the end of gaming?

At first, I was thinking i'm just ready for NextGen, 360 and PS3. And though I am, do I really want to 3 years from now look back and see all the time I invested in either of those platforms? Hell, I can just buy another Motorcycle or buy that 24 Track recorder I've been wanting.

Anybody else out there thinking, is it time to stop gaming? Or do you guys think you will all be gamers for life?

[Gadfly2317]

I spent more this gen than any other period of gaming in my life.

Will I quit gaming? Taking a break from gaming, like you mentioned, is always a big plus. I've gamed since the 70's; since Pong, since my first console the Oddyssey II from Phillips-Magnavox. I've taken breaks from videogames for more than year before, but have always returned.

That's the thing: gaming. It's not just videogames. I was a board game junky since as early as I can remember, and into actual basketball, volleyball, croquet, and comptetition swimming. I will never stop being competitive or into games. It's just who I am. I'm thinking of taking up frisbee golf and lawn bowling because I moved somewhere within walking distance of both of these things and I've never done them before.

But its not money; or even just time. I expect carpal tunnel/tendonitis and maybe even osteo-arthritis--which is projected to hit our generation big-time--to be the thing that ends my videogaming. My sore thumbs are one of the things that has left me so impressed with the DS, and so hopeful for the Revolution.

Next gen, I have no interest in dropping $400-$500 on systems that have me doing things I'm already getting bored of this gen. As enthused as I am by the potential of the Rev, I'm not sold on getting it yet either--don't know the cost, don't know the launch games. But as early as two years ago I was talking about this gen being my last; the Rev is the only thing right now really making me reconsider that--and not because I'm a Nintendo fan or because I want to play Mario Kart with remote control, but because the system offers the biggest potential to do something truly new in gaming, and also to possibly do it in the lowest impact way.

Otherwise, no, I'll never quit gaming, but already I'm turning into a new kind of gamer, an older gamer in this busy world who finds electronic games--shockwave games, cellphone games like Zuma, and handheld systems filling the little dull moments, but not much time for sitting on my ass for hours in front of the TV playing games. And though I foresee myself getting a Rev and maybe even one of the other two when they drop in price, it's not something I want to drop much money on, because I already know that no matter how great the graphics, I'm just not going to be spending enough time with it to justify dropping nearly enough money to chill out for a week in the Carribean.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

I spent more this gen than any other period of gaming in my life.

Will I quit gaming? Taking a break from gaming, like you mentioned, is always a big plus. I've gamed since the 70's; since Pong, since my first console the Oddyssey II from Phillips-Magnavox. I've taken breaks from videogames for more than year before, but have always returned.

That's the thing: gaming. It's not just videogames. I was a board game junky since as early as I can remember, and into actual basketball, volleyball, croquet, and comptetition swimming. I will never stop being competitive or into games. It's just who I am. I'm thinking of taking up frisbee golf and lawn bowling because I moved somewhere within walking distance of both of these things and I've never done them before.

But its not money; or even just time. I expect carpal tunnel/tendonitis and maybe even osteo-arthritis--which is projected to hit our generation big-time--to be the thing that ends my videogaming. My sore thumbs are one of the things that has left me so impressed with the DS, and so hopeful for the Revolution.

Next gen, I have no interest in dropping $400-$500 on systems that have me doing things I'm already getting bored of this gen. As enthused as I am by the potential of the Rev, I'm not sold on getting it yet either--don't know the cost, don't know the launch games. But as early as two years ago I was talking about this gen being my last; the Rev is the only thing right now really making me reconsider that--and not because I'm a Nintendo fan or because I want to play Mario Kart with remote control, but because the system offers the biggest potential to do something truly new in gaming, and also to possibly do it in the lowest impact way.

Otherwise, no, I'll never quit gaming, but already I'm turning into a new kind of gamer, an older gamer in this busy world who finds electronic games--shockwave games, cellphone games like Zuma, and handheld systems filling the little dull moments, but not much time for sitting on my ass for hours in front of the TV playing games. And though I foresee myself getting a Rev and maybe even one of the other two when they drop in price, it's not something I want to drop much money on, because I already know that no matter how great the graphics, I'm just not going to be spending enough time with it to justify dropping nearly enough money to chill out for a week in the Carribean.

First of all, thanks for not turning this into a flamewar. I concur with your thought about always playing sports, but I don't equate them with gaming. I'm specifically talking about videogaming, though I understand if you group them together. I play a lot of sports too and derive a different sort of pleasure from athletics, also I work out rigorously, and both have tangible benefits that gaming doesn't provide. But, maybe, what I need to do, is treat gaming like an occasional hobby like tennis or basketball, instead of a daily ritual.

I have yet to really experience any physical effects of gaming like sore hands/wrists, guess i'm just lucky in that regard. Though i do worry about this long term. But truthfully playing guitar is a million times worse on my hands and wrist than gaming ever has been. Also playing ball, i've had some painful finger jams from balling that brought a tear to my eye. Plus i've had my thumb broken and wrist.

Looking back at this generation in the perspective of all those games on my HDD, and I am questioning myself. I don't know if I want to do this again next generation. Its like seeing your tracks in the sand, you can remember every step and it makes you question everytime you said to yourself, I could do this if i only had more time. Well, that 20 hours playing Dark Watch was considerable time. If I game next gen, i'm not telling myself, it won't be much. But if isn't going to be much, then why invest the cost. When I add up all those hours, if I had of put them into my guitar or keyboards, i'd be damn good.

I don't know, i'm gonna see how I feel about gaming, and make a decision. I might just quit cold turkey in the most extreme, or in the least extreme dramatically reduce my gaming. I played online this weekend for the 2nd time since I returned to gaming, and i'm sitting here racing asking myself, what is the purpose of this. I did two races and stopped. It was hellafun before, but now I don't know if I can derive any more fun from it. I think i'm always going to be asking myself, why am I doing this. Even after I went offline, I started playing Jade Empire, and I was asking myself, what is the purpose of me finishing this game.

[theWacoKid]

I've stopped gaming plenty of times, a year or even longer at a stretch. I bought a genesis at launch, played it for about 8 months, sold it off and then was out of gaming for over a year. Rebought the genesis with sonic as a pack in and NHL hocky.

Next time I took a break was before the dreamcast launched. Prior to the DC launch, I'd stopped playing both the n64 and ps. Another year off then.

Next time, I moved, packed all my gear and for six months I just didn't feel like unpacking any of my current gen systems.

The worst thing you can do is to buy a game you don't like and finish it just to finish it like you're doing with darkwatch. You already got ripped on the price, now you're getting ripped of your time. Why add insult to injury? Time is more important than money. Money you can replace, time you can't. That's why I'm outta forums like this and the other game related message boards on a permanent basis very shortly, so if people want to take their parting shots at me, do it now, because this is a time liimited offer and once I'm gone, I'm gone.

Gaming is just a smile, really, at its essential basic, that's all it is, its not reality, its a diversion. But, if it makes you feel better, gaming is miles better than plunking your ass and watching reruns of friends.

I use gaming as a barometer of where I'm at mentally and psychologically. Am I up to the challenge of a puzzle or not. How am I handling a game's difficulty, am I getting angry, easily frustrated, giving up or am I rising to the challenge, keeping my cool and figuring it out. I don't have the motor skills I once did, so now I have to play smarter, not better. Xbox live kind of stunk that way it is now, with way too many cretins out there you couldn't avoid. Now, you'll have a system where gamers with bad reps will be filtered out of optimatch. So, the cheating, profane little douchebags can play with each other for a change. I think it'll be a much better service this time around.

I don't know how much actual money I spent this gen, far too much, I expect, because there have been far too many options available. That's why I keep harping on I want to get down to just one console. Keep things simple, play what's available for that system and screw the rest. I know that if I can't get myself down to one console and make things manageable, that I'm selling off everything and quitting gaming altogether. Three consoles is just nuts, the madness simply has to end. And handhelds, unfortunately, just dont' cut it in the visceral impact sweepstakes. I'm never going to be a hardcore handheld gamer.

Those great games you thought you couldn't live without. Reality is, you can live without them quite easilly. You're just suffering from the inevitable burnout scenario. Too many of the same games where you're perfoming the same activiites. Even if you love burgers, if all you do is eat burgers all the time, you'll get sick of them and wonder how you ever liked a burger to begin with.

One of the best reasons for getting rid of a console, is so you don't sink any more money into it. One of the best reasons for not gettng a console period, is so you don't spent your money and time into it. It's an entertainment option, and you have to figure out how its going to fit into your lifestyle. If you're ultra competitve as I suspect you are, you're going to invest a lot of time to become skilled and proficient at a game.

If you're not ready or psyched for next gen, then don't buy a 360 at launch. If I felt like you, I definitely wouldn't. But, for me, the 360 is a non-cash layout, I'm just readjusting my existing entertainment dollars. I have enough in credit at EB to buy 3 games for the 360, before I have to reach in my wallet. If the 360 doesn't work out, I'm out of gaming for a long while, because the ps3 and rev aren't going to be offering anything better. Like I actually want to pretend I'm fishing with a tv remote.

Next gen for me is about visceral impact. Genres like sports, racing, fps, military sims are all going to benefit from the jump in power. Everybody is dumping on madden, but here are some of the facts concerning next gen madden from the senior producer of the game.

"There are more polys in our next gen helmet than there were in the complete player from previous versions of Madden."

" we will deliver as many innovations in game play with an animation system driven by over three times the number of animations as previous versions of Madden."

Those are those the kinds of things I want, stuff that is going to drive the visceral impact of the game. PGR3 will have spectators, lots of spectators that will actually react to the activity on the racetrack, you'll have a racetrack editor, an insane amount of trackside detail, and gotham tv is going to have a huge impact on the way online gaming is handled in the future. I'm more than up to watching the best players in the world face each other off in a televised tournament on Gotham TV with big prize money at stake.

Your fps games will be finally looking and playing the way they should've all along. Your military sims, your Tom Clancy games are going to be way better in graphics, AI and featrue set. Ghost recon and GR:IT looked like total ass on the xbox, the AI in the RS games is scripted and your teammate AI is brainless. You seemed to have loved these games, but you're going to pass up next gen versions?! I don't get it.

The thing about the ps2 is that games like R&C, J&D and Sly Cooper play very well on the system. I liked those games so for me the ps2 was great because it played those games well. On the other hand, while the xbox had much better versions of games like the GR and RS games than the ps2, I still thought they were lacking. Next gen, those games are going to be where they should've been all along.

Why you want to spend $50 on a watered down port of half life 2 for the xbox is beyond me. Dumbed down graphics, a struggling framerate. Why not spend it on a next gen fps like PDZ or COD2? At least they'll look better and play smoother. You've got an HDTVl, don't you. The upgrade in pixel count is going to be huge. You're looking at a pixel count upgrade of 3X for owners of high def sets and if anybody thinks that won't make an impact, think again. I think the xbox 360 is going to be a much better console than the xbox ever was.

Hell, even I'm looking at some hdtv's now. The quality of new sets is rising dramatically and the costs are dropping quickly. Flat panel is still too pricey, but projection lcd and dlp are featuring very good price to performance ratios now. Next january, after the xmas crush has passed, I'll be doing some shopping and some low balling on retailers.

Buck up, you're bored stiff with gaming right now. It happens. Its happened plenty of times to me. Every time I quit gaming, I thought I'd never go back, but I always have, so far. I enjoy gaming more now, then I did back in the old days. In the old days, all it was about was the challenge, because the graphics and sound sucked and the gameplay was very limiting. Today, you can have modern 3d gaming with cinematic presentation or I can play Yoshi's Island on my ds, which is probably my overall favorite 2d platformer ever. I can have my cake and eat it, too.

I'm down to a DS with about a dozen ds and gba games and a ps2 with 3 games. I"m taking a break of sorts. I won't be buying any more ps2 games. I'll rent here and there, but my ps2 game purchases are effectively over. The thing is, 360 or no 360, I'd be doing the same, winding down purchases on current gen and just renting on the odd occassion. That's how its been for me on virtually every console transition. You kind of hit your apex and then there's a decline. Even if the games are good, they just don't impress that much anymore. DMC3 just didn't impress me that much, even though I know intellectually its a better game than DMC, the impact of the original just isn't there. That's why the sales of DMC3 are so much lower than DMC.

You've got pre-launch jitters. What if the 360 isn't what its cracked out to be. When has any console blown away people at launch. All the talk of the dreamcast launch as best launch ever. I bought 4 games for the DC, regretted three of those purchases. Didn't even buy NFL 2k because it had a horribly flawed running game. Only Soul Calibur shined, and even that became old hat after a while. Unless your buddies like to play 3d fighting games, fighting against the cpu can get boring quickly.

The 360 launch is miles better than what the ps2 offered at its launch. The ps2 launch except for maybe about half a dozen titles was downright embaressing. DS had nothing, the psp had a puzzle game as its flagship title. Somehow, I don't think the 360 has all that much to worry about.

Take a break, stop playing the current gen games, because you're bored stiif of them. Recharge your batteries, tone down your expectations and realize the games being offerd within the launch window don't even begin to tap out the potential of the hardware. Second gen will display games programmed from the ground up around the xbox360 hardware and this is kick ass hardware. If this hardware can't deliver games with visceral impact, nothing will. Its up to the game designers now, no more excuses of working with limited hardware. Bring on next gen and crank up that surround sound.

[theWacoKid]

by Matt Leone 09/17/2005


While we've been treated to numerous Call of Duty 2 demonstrations at this point, at the Tokyo Game Show we finally had the chance to go hands-on with Infinity Ward's sequel for the first time. Though the area on display was just a short segment of a level shown previously, the hands-on session proved one thing beyond any doubt: this is one of the most intense game experiences around.

As we started up the demo, there were two enemies positioned and waiting for us to walk five feet forward and show our face outside the house we were in. If we ran outside, they'd take us out in all of five seconds -- which happened more than a couple of times -- and if we stayed inside, we couldn't really do our job of taking them out. So we had to use cover carefully right from the start, which gives a good idea of the flow of the game. There's a clear message given right away: don't run out in the open.

Essentially, every bullet matters, so you need to do everything you can to hide behind cars, buildings, gun emplacements, sand bags, etc. and then pick out your best shots when the gunfire drops down on the opposing side. Sounds pretty typical, sure, but the way Call of Duty 2 excels in this area is by combining overpowering visual effects with a well-developed sense of being on a team. When you see your allies jumping over walls and propped up against barricades all over, and then you hear them telling you about the situation ahead and even giving you tips on how to get past certain areas, it adds a lot to the feeling of urgency present. While playing, we actually had to lean away from the screen quite a few times because the action was so intense -- it's been a long time since that happened.

The TGS demo of Call of Duty 2 isn't perfect overall, with a few texture quality issues on some of the buildings, but the controls are great, the graphics hold up well compared to the PC version, and the pacing is unbelievably well done. We're told the game will be ready to ship at the Xbox 360 launch, so hopefully the whole game can keep up the spirit of this demo come November 22nd.


This is what I'm talking about, dude, visceral impact. I never looked twice at COD on the consoles, I'm definitely considering this as a game purchase. Noticed they used the word intense more than a couple of times. Screw cut scenes and pretty trailers, oh, look how detailed snake is and how the lighting hits his face. Who the efff cares. I want hear stuff like this, "This is one of the most intense games experiences around."

[MoNkEy MaN X]

In the past year I took a big jump back from gaming. I was running a Counter-Strike / Counter-Strike Source clan even... I played on XBL, had all 3 systems at one point. GBA, even DC... I put alot of time into playing games. But about 9 months ago, I just dropped my clan, closed down the server and site. I was even renting and hosting servers for people, which there wasn't much profit involved. I feel good that I calmed down.

Now I still have my PC, which I barely game on, instead it is my DAW(digital audio workstation). I decided to start writing and recording music much more than before since the rewards are much more than complete a game or competing online in a game. I still have a PS2 and XBOX. All I really play here and there is Hot Shots Golf Fore though, Gradius V for as long as I can stand it. Not much else. I was looking at a couple new games coming out but I don't know if I will actually buy them. I really liked the Suffering and would like to get the sequal, but I'm not sure if I want to drop the time or money... Same thing with Indigo Prophecies... I really like the horror style genre still.

I am looking at getting a 360 possibly to continue my casual gaming activities now. I will probably trade in both my current systems to get it. Either that or wait for a PS3. I would like to keep it down to 1 system since I don't play much.

http://www.soundclick.com/aliennotation

That is the music I work on now. That is how I like to spend my free time, but sometimes I need a break, and that is when I watch a movie, or play a game. I would say, take a break, but to not give up all together, since it is a pretty fun way to waste time.

[Gadfly2317]

When I add up all those hours, if I had of put them into my guitar or keyboards, i'd be damn good. Tell me about it! But then, even when I quit gaming, I'm just sorta lazy by nature and have yet to be disiplined about my writing and music. Still, its hard to look about the hours spent on gaming, reading about games, writing about games, and not feel like you've wasted way too much time. Hell, if every gamer just took 20% of the time they did gaming and used that time for charity work. . . . well, anyway, you know.


I don't know, i'm gonna see how I feel about gaming, and make a decision. I might just quit cold turkey in the most extreme, or in the least extreme dramatically reduce my gaming. I played online this weekend for the 2nd time since I returned to gaming, and i'm sitting here racing asking myself, what is the purpose of this. I did two races and stopped. It was hellafun before, but now I don't know if I can derive any more fun from it. I think i'm always going to be asking myself, why am I doing this. Even after I went offline, I started playing Jade Empire, and I was asking myself, what is the purpose of me finishing this game. I think Waco is right. I mean, it is possible that you aren't able to derive fun out of certain types of games permanently, but its probably just burn-out. If you cold turkey right now, you might even be ready for next gen come Nov. 22. Just buy WAY fewer games, the best of the best, or else the very best of your very favorite types of games. I've tried to play everything this gen, on all systems, and its just stupid assed insane. I have every confidence that I will have no problem buying fewer games and systems this time, and I'm pretty sure I'll actually have a lot more fun gaming because of it.

You can't back out on 360 now; and Waco, this is the worst time for you to stop posting. We need you guys to buy 360's and post about it--just because I think the system is overpriced and has few launch titles I'm interested, making it easy to wait, I still love games, its impossible to truly hate a game system, and so I'm looking forward even more to hearing what you guys think about the system after you get it since I'm not getting one myself.

[Pandarbock]

I spent more this gen than any other period of gaming in my life.


Same here i have spent way to much, I am at 30 gba titles, 15 ps2, 8 ds, and a whopping 1 shy of 100 gamecube titles, as well as a psp with 1 game. so maybe around $4500-5000 spent thus far in the last 4-5 years.

[Gadfly2317]

I am looking at getting a 360 possibly to continue my casual gaming activities now. I will probably trade in both my current systems to get it. Either that or wait for a PS3. I would like to keep it down to 1 system since I don't play much.

http://www.soundclick.com/aliennotation

That is the music I work on now. That is how I like to spend my free time, but sometimes I need a break, and that is when I watch a movie, or play a game. I would say, take a break, but to not give up all together, since it is a pretty fun way to waste time.

How did you do the drums? What recording software do you like to use? You've got a great rhythm guitar sound going.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

by Matt Leone 09/17/2005


This is what I'm talking about, dude, visceral impact. I never looked twice at COD on the consoles, I'm definitely considering this as a game purchase. Noticed they used the word intense more than a couple of times. Screw cut scenes and pretty trailers, oh, look how detailed snake is and how the lighting hits his face. Who the efff cares. I want hear stuff like this, "This is one of the most intense games experiences around."

Thanks Waco, I read everything you said in both posts. Think you have a point. I know i'm burned out. Despite the fact I loved my franchises, i'm bored with them. And I am anticipating 360 because i'm over this generation. I think I'll be blown away with the performance of the next gen systems, in fact I know I will. But, when I look out into the future and ask myself, do I really want to invest as much time and even more money into a new platform. I honestly can't answer it. My initial thought is no I don't, I shouldn't. When I think and know I have other things I can invest that time in and later say i'm better for it, I can't say that of gaming. And if I buy only four games a year, let's assume that is 100 hours of gaming, now i'm questioning, was that 100 hours of my life a complete waste, aside from just entertainment?

There are some definite times of the day or night I should say, that really lend themselves to gaming. When you have a family and are a night owl, then about 11pm to 2am, are really empty hours. Everyone is sleep or sleepy and you are up. In that time period you aren't likely to be doing anything(aside from gettin some) such as playing music or sports. So gaming during that time period can serve a purpose. The other thing in gaming's favor, is family gaming, we had some fun times with family and friends on games like DOA, Soul Calibur, Fuzion Frenzy. And during the holiday's when family is visiting the gaming console is putting in major overtime with all the visitors. But, as Gadfly said, so are normal games, board games, card games, etc.

I don't know, I have to see how I feel over the next few weeks or months. I'm not sad about it, i'm actually happy. I think I kinda know the answer, but just don't want to admit it. I think I know I can and need to be doing other things with those thousands of hours over the next five years. Thousands of hours and $$$ that I really have nothing to show for.

Well, if you do leave the site, I've greatly enjoyed our battles. Most of the time we weren't on the same side, but that's cool. This site and system wars has never been a negative for me, its always added to my gaming experience, and gave me something to do at work, like now. Maybe you will come back after a while. Myself, I guess my presence on these boards is tied to the fate of my gaming. If I stop gaming, I guess I'll stop posting too. But i'll definitely be checking back just to see if everyone's expectations about the next gen were met. For every person who leaves system wars, another person comes along and fills his spot. But if I do continue gaming and am on LIVE, look up Codename Havok if your one 360. I know once before I asked you to try out some games with myself and Darwin, I think you woulda had a different opinion of LIVE if you would have.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

In the past year I took a big jump back from gaming. I was running a Counter-Strike / Counter-Strike Source clan even... I played on XBL, had all 3 systems at one point. GBA, even DC... I put alot of time into playing games. But about 9 months ago, I just dropped my clan, closed down the server and site. I was even renting and hosting servers for people, which there wasn't much profit involved. I feel good that I calmed down.

Now I still have my PC, which I barely game on, instead it is my DAW(digital audio workstation). I decided to start writing and recording music much more than before since the rewards are much more than complete a game or competing online in a game. I still have a PS2 and XBOX. All I really play here and there is Hot Shots Golf Fore though, Gradius V for as long as I can stand it. Not much else. I was looking at a couple new games coming out but I don't know if I will actually buy them. I really liked the Suffering and would like to get the sequal, but I'm not sure if I want to drop the time or money... Same thing with Indigo Prophecies... I really like the horror style genre still.

I am looking at getting a 360 possibly to continue my casual gaming activities now. I will probably trade in both my current systems to get it. Either that or wait for a PS3. I would like to keep it down to 1 system since I don't play much.

http://www.soundclick.com/aliennotation

That is the music I work on now. That is how I like to spend my free time, but sometimes I need a break, and that is when I watch a movie, or play a game. I would say, take a break, but to not give up all together, since it is a pretty fun way to waste time.

You have some great gear, i don't have that much yet. Basically I've got my Ovation Legend 1771 guitar, Marshall amp, a Korg Tritan Extreme 88 key workstation and monitors for it, got some mics. I've got nothing in the line of recording equipment. Which is one of the things i'll be addressing soon. I don't know if I wanna go with a PC based setup or go with a hardware based 16 or 24 track recorder. On the one side I want simplicity and portability, on the other end the PC based setup is very versatile. I'm also going to buy some Congas real soon, after coming back from Mexico and hearing live Congas I need 'em. I've been playing music now for about 3 years and i'm still a newbie and this is the main thing that is competing for my gaming hours.

Its funny cause this summer I had family visit for about 3 weeks, then went on back to back vacations for a week each and the entire time the thing I missed most was my guitar, didn't even miss gaming. I'm finally reaching that point where i'm starting to get good and its like exponential progress, whereas before I felt like i'll never be able to do this. Also, when I was in Mexico there were so many live bands playing Latin music, traditional mexican music, and I was very impressed, and I felt like I should be where they are, in terms of skill(lying to myself these guys have been playing their whole lives) or at least trying to get there.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Tell me about it! But then, even when I quit gaming, I'm just sorta lazy by nature and have yet to be disiplined about my writing and music. Still, its hard to look about the hours spent on gaming, reading about games, writing about games, and not feel like you've wasted way too much time. Hell, if every gamer just took 20% of the time they did gaming and used that time for charity work. . . . well, anyway, you know.


I think Waco is right. I mean, it is possible that you aren't able to derive fun out of certain types of games permanently, but its probably just burn-out. If you cold turkey right now, you might even be ready for next gen come Nov. 22. Just buy WAY fewer games, the best of the best, or else the very best of your very favorite types of games. I've tried to play everything this gen, on all systems, and its just stupid assed insane. I have every confidence that I will have no problem buying fewer games and systems this time, and I'm pretty sure I'll actually have a lot more fun gaming because of it.

You can't back out on 360 now; and Waco, this is the worst time for you to stop posting. We need you guys to buy 360's and post about it--just because I think the system is overpriced and has few launch titles I'm interested, making it easy to wait, I still love games, its impossible to truly hate a game system, and so I'm looking forward even more to hearing what you guys think about the system after you get it since I'm not getting one myself.

See you, Fivespot, Monkey Man and myself, all budding musicians. Maybe the thing that's stopping us from being really good, is wasted time, lol. Well, I shouldn't presume you guys aren't already good. Anyway, when i think about 360 and games like Gears of War, Oblivion, eventually Ninja Gaiden2, Halo3, that is why I don't want to game any more. Just think about Oblivion. Those kinds of games are going to be very addictive and require scores of hours. I mean just buying the AAA games(which was my in-going philosophy for nextgen) is still going to consume monster hours. And while I think it will be fun and exciting and just five or ten fold better than this gen, 360 or PS3, I just don't know that it still isn't just a waste of time, for myself. I mean its a personal thing, when I was gaming over the years, i've never considered it a waste of time. But, presently, i'm starting to feel like that and I think that's because there isn't enough time in the day any more. Recently I've felt that I've been under time constraints, but I never considered gaming as a source of time. Plus I've never considered stopping gaming, why? And could I, now after taking a hiatus, I realize I can, to no ill-effect.

Anyway, don't worry about us XBOTs man. Didn't you know, if you one XBOT falls two more come to replace him. You never know, you might get the virus next gen and become an XBOT!

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Same here i have spent way to much, I am at 30 gba titles, 15 ps2, 8 ds, and a whopping 1 shy of 100 gamecube titles, as well as a psp with 1 game. so maybe around $4500-5000 spent thus far in the last 4-5 years.

Wow, just 100 GC games alone at about $50 each is five grand! I know your titles probably didn't average $50, but still it is staggering. I wonder if I bought 100 XBOX titles, its possible. Damn, maybe we should start a Gamer's Anonymous. I don't think VGR is gonna like this thread, lol!

[Gadfly2317]

I'm also going to buy some Congas real soon, after coming back from Mexico and hearing live Congas I need 'em. I've been playing music now for about 3 years and i'm still a newbie and this is the main thing that is competing for my gaming hours.

I recommend a few sets of Donkey Congas. All joking aside though, that was actually the most kick ass party game I ever played with my kids (they wanted another damned Mario Party game, and there was just no way I was going to play another one of those.)

I do have a couple different hand drums; but not congas. Drumming is extremely relaxing and fun. Currently I'm combining my gaming and music; I'm recording strange abrasive ambient noise-collages using Electroplankton, Warioware Touched, and Meteos (which has this huge set of sound samples it lets you play with.) Heavily tweaked and editied and cutup stuff, it doesn't sound much like the source. It's hilarious. I just got a cable and plugged the DS straight into my PC.

[Gadfly2317]

See you, Fivespot, Monkey Man and myself, all budding musicians. Maybe the thing that's stopping us from being really good, is wasted time, lol. Well, I shouldn't presume you guys aren't already good. Anyway, when i think about 360 and games like Gears of War, Oblivion, eventually Ninja Gaiden2, Halo3, that is why I don't want to game any more. Just think about Oblivion. Those kinds of games are going to be very addictive and require scores of hours. I mean just buying the AAA games(which was my in-going philosophy for nextgen) is still going to consume monster hours. And while I think it will be fun and exciting and just five or ten fold better than this gen, 360 or PS3, I just don't know that it still isn't just a waste of time, for myself. I mean its a personal thing, when I was gaming over the years, i've never considered it a waste of time. But, presently, i'm starting to feel like that and I think that's because there isn't enough time in the day any more. Recently I've felt that I've been under time constraints, but I never considered gaming as a source of time. Plus I've never considered stopping gaming, why? And could I, now after taking a hiatus, I realize I can, to no ill-effect.

Anyway, don't worry about us XBOTs man. Didn't you know, if you one XBOT falls two more come to replace him. You never know, you might get the virus next gen and become an XBOT!


What's worse than not being good is the thought of all that great gear you could have owned. (I only own one bragging piece: A 1956 Les Paul Special. I don't even have an amp right now, for christs sake, so I'm only playing my acoustic.)

If I get the bug and become a next gen x-bot--it's always possible--I can still assure you it won't be at launch, at that price :)

[MoNkEy MaN X]

Anything could be percieved as a waste of time. Reading books, writing poetry, learning history, skateboarding, playing videogames, etc... It's just how you look at it. If you are getting some kind of pleasure out of it, I guess it's not really a waste of time, only if you are not enjoying yourself. Now, I have learned how to put down the controller and turn off a game if it isn't fun.

Gadfly, I use a program called drumkits from hell superior as a drum plugin and samples. It has about 40Gb or so of unprocessed samples, so you need to understand a good amount of EQ and compression techniques. It is made by a company called toontrack, http://www.toontrack.com . I recommend it if you really want to learn how to properly mix drums, this way if you ever record live drums you will already have a good idea of what you are doing.

I use Cubase SX3 as my recording software host. I really like it. I use PC, not MAC as well... I really want to get a new Dual Core Processor though, that would be a huge improvement to my setup. My guitar is running through a POD XT Pro into a Presonus Firepod, which is a firewire soundcard.

MaskedGamer, I recommend going PC all the way. I came from a Tascam tape 4 track, to a Korg Digital 8 Track, to a Korg Digital 16 track, to what I have now... It is hard to express with words how much better PC based recording is over those stand alone units. When you buy a program like Cubase, you can use a bunch of different instrument plugins and effect plugins, most in the format called VST. I have my drummer VST instrument, and 2 synth VST instruments with huge sample libraries. A midi keyboard to control them too. I have so many different EQ, Compression, Mastering, and other types of effects in the form of VST also. If you have any questions I will gladly answer them for you regarding the PC style setup, or the stand alone unit setups. I would like to have a Korg workstation but it isn't in the budget since I have so much other stuff, plus my synths are all on the comp, but it would be awsome live having a Triton.

[theWacoKid]

Thanks Waco, I read everything you said in both posts. Think you have a point. I know i'm burned out. Despite the fact I loved my franchises, i'm bored with them. And I am anticipating 360 because i'm over this generation. I think I'll be blown away with the performance of the next gen systems, in fact I know I will. But, when I look out into the future and ask myself, do I really want to invest as much time and even more money into a new platform. I honestly can't answer it. My initial thought is no I don't, I shouldn't. When I think and know I have other things I can invest that time in and later say i'm better for it, I can't say that of gaming. And if I buy only four games a year, let's assume that is 100 hours of gaming, now i'm questioning, was that 100 hours of my life a complete waste, aside from just entertainment?

There are some definite times of the day or night I should say, that really lend themselves to gaming. When you have a family and are a night owl, then about 11pm to 2am, are really empty hours. Everyone is sleep or sleepy and you are up. In that time period you aren't likely to be doing anything(aside from gettin some) such as playing music or sports. So gaming during that time period can serve a purpose. The other thing in gaming's favor, is family gaming, we had some fun times with family and friends on games like DOA, Soul Calibur, Fuzion Frenzy. And during the holiday's when family is visiting the gaming console is putting in major overtime with all the visitors. But, as Gadfly said, so are normal games, board games, card games, etc.

I don't know, I have to see how I feel over the next few weeks or months. I'm not sad about it, i'm actually happy. I think I kinda know the answer, but just don't want to admit it. I think I know I can and need to be doing other things with those thousands of hours over the next five years. Thousands of hours and $$$ that I really have nothing to show for.

Well, if you do leave the site, I've greatly enjoyed our battles. Most of the time we weren't on the same side, but that's cool. This site and system wars has never been a negative for me, its always added to my gaming experience, and gave me something to do at work, like now. Maybe you will come back after a while. Myself, I guess my presence on these boards is tied to the fate of my gaming. If I stop gaming, I guess I'll stop posting too. But i'll definitely be checking back just to see if everyone's expectations about the next gen were met. For every person who leaves system wars, another person comes along and fills his spot. But if I do continue gaming and am on LIVE, look up Codename Havok if your one 360. I know once before I asked you to try out some games with myself and Darwin, I think you woulda had a different opinion of LIVE if you would have.

If you need a long extended break from gaming, go for it. It'll still be here when and if you return. Story telling is something that every culture that has ever existed has done. Its very primal, its very important for the development of a culture and for our own personal development. Gaming has more potential in the story telling art form than any other medium I know of. It has the potential to exceed books, film, and music, because its interactive, you can change and alter the story, something that cannot be done in other mediums. The potential is there for players to make moral decisions on whether they kill someone or not, show mercy and let them live. Will that decision be your savior as that character you helped out saves you at a later point in the game or will that character be your assasin and finish your quest? I think gaming is still in its infancy as a storytelling medium. I think the potential is very,very exciting.

The problem right now, is that artistry is way behind the technical abilities. Kojima might be a talented game developer, but he sucks balls as a storyteller. TMG, I'll never be a defensive lineman in the NFL, but I can act out my fantasies in Madden. I'd rather play madden than watch football. I can toss a football around some too, but my knees are shot, I got a bad back, and I got bursitis in my shoulder. I still play basketball and I can shoot pretty well, but I can't drive to the basket any longer or put any pressure on my knees, they'll just give way. A military sim done right will give you a much better idea of what its like to be in the line of fire, than any war movie ever made. Real consequences for your actions, not this retarded AI just running straight at you looking to be shot.

I think gaming has great potential in this area, fusing the curent art forms of books, music and film and elevating them beyond what's currently possible. Man, imagine a Stanley Kubrick in charge of directing a game or a Steven Spielberg. That's why when I look at nintendo, I just kind of go, who cares, because I know for nintendo, these guys don't give a flying eff about turning gaming into a storytelling mediium. That means investing money into production values and thats not something they want to do. I want to play a game, that when I reach the end, I'm shocked and speechless by the conclusion, because its something so unexpected, that I never would have thought of that. Haven't played that game yet, but, I'm still looking.

If you're on live, I'll look for you, Codename Havok. Whatever you decide, my advice is to chill for a while. You obviously need the break. I"m taking a mini-break now and cutting back. I'll be off the forums for good shortly and I'll be down to checking on gaming news once a week for about an hour or so and that's it.

[Pandarbock]

Wow, just 100 GC games alone at about $50 each is five grand! I know your titles probably didn't average $50, but still it is staggering. I wonder if I bought 100 XBOX titles, its possible. Damn, maybe we should start a Gamer's Anonymous. I don't think VGR is gonna like this thread, lol!
Touche, yeah no kidding, I seriously do need to stop buying games, I really do know I am addicted. Although I have nothing but myself to answer to so I am only hurting myself and no one else with my impulsive fix spending. Anyway I averaged all my games at about $25 each which is probably a bit low but a good number of them are Greatest Hits.

[Darwin]

What did the Apostle Paul say? "When I became a man, I put away childish tendencies". :-)

J/K. Gaming should serve a purpose. The purpose will be different for each person. Entertainment, challenge, social interaction, stress release, etc. When it ceases to serve its purpose for you, you should move on or put it aside for as long as you need. You shouldn't have to force yourself to game. Just think of it as a tool that is always there for you, should you want it. It's value is not necessarily how much you use it, but the fact that it's readily available.

For me, I talk alot about gaming with coworkers. So, it has the added benefit of building friendships. Since I don't watch sports (other than racing), this is what I can fall back on. I also had a restricted social life when in college. I would study sooo much in college. I spent very little time gaming. So now I am "making up for lost time".

[Mochan]

Not sure how much cash I've spent this gen. A lot less than you guys definitely; although my hardware cost a LOT more, I recoup with far lesser costs for my software. That said, my hardware spendings for this gen were a pre-modded PS2 which went for about $330, four Dual Shock 2s, a lightgun and memory card, and then a whole array of PC hardware that I'm not even going to begin tallying (but for reference, I bought two PCs this gen because the first one blew up from a faulty PSU).


But its not money; or even just time. I expect carpal tunnel/tendonitis and maybe even osteo-arthritis--which is projected to hit our generation big-time--to be the thing that ends my videogaming.

This is what I am afraid of as well. I am already showing the signs of it: my left middle finger aches quickly from RSS due to years of playing WASD, and my right hand near the wrist where the mouse rests on the pad also tends to get a dull ache.

Nintendinitis struck me back in the days of the FamiCom.

To safeguard against eye damage I bought an LCD screen despite CRTs still being better overall for gaming due to how they display the color black.

After over two decades of gaming I've had to deal with the reality that this hobby may be damaging to my body, and that I have to take precautions to safeguard myself and extend my gaming years.

And I'm finding, i'm not enjoying it the same. I'm finding that for the first time, when I have absolutely NOTHING to do but leisure activities, gaming is the last thing i'm reaching for and i'm actually forcing myself to do it.

I rejected Television a long time ago (around the start of my college days) and the only thing I can watch on TV is news and documentaries. I do understand your concern though: did video gaming really improve my life? I'm not sure and the answer I came up with could be labelled as sophistric BS.

That said, I think I'm going to be a gamer for life. I've taken brief breaks from gaming but only to substitute with other hobbies I relate to gaming, like watching anime and doing other forms of gaming like card gaming, board gaming, P&P gaming, etc. I never thought of it as turning my back to gaming: simply that I found that there weren't any good games at the moment so I had to do something else while waiting for the next big game to come out. I mentioned in another thread that I'm through a dry spell in both PS2 and PC gaming so things are just slow right now; I expect things to pick up later this year or early next year.

I'm a gamer through and through, for better or worse and I really don't see it changing. The way I game may change but I think I'll be a gamer til I can't game anymore.

[Mochan]

As we started up the demo, there were two enemies positioned and waiting for us to walk five feet forward and show our face outside the house we were in. If we ran outside, they'd take us out in all of five seconds -- which happened more than a couple of times -- and if we stayed inside, we couldn't really do our job of taking them out. So we had to use cover carefully right from the start, which gives a good idea of the flow of the game. There's a clear message given right away: don't run out in the open.

That's a little disconcerting; it's true you shouldn't run out in the open if there's a battalion of enemies facing you but against two grunts, what FPS player worth his salt wouldn't be able to take them out?

Still COD has always been about the cinematic experience and the rest of the article shows that the same sense of awe is still intact. Man I can't wait for this game. I still feel obliged though to say that this kind of experience ("one of the most intense game experiences around") could have been had a lot earlier with Call of Duty 1. The way they describe it is the exact same way I felt playing Call of Duty 1.

I would also have to say that I felt the same way playing Metal Gear Solid 1. That too was one of the most intense experiences I had to date at the time, though a lot of it had to do with the story and characters as much as it did with the action. COD1's experience was a lot more intense in retrospect, hands down, and it relied on nothing but the pacing and action on screen.

And if MGS4 has the kind of gameplay experience we saw in the trailer, it'll also easily be one of the most intense experiences around. Big battle does that to you; COD1 had this in spades, and there are very few equivalents of it on consoles (Zone of Enders 2 in the "big battle" scene and some scenes from Darkstone/LOTR come to mind) but MGS4 looks to have the same potential.




See you, Fivespot, Monkey Man and myself, all budding musicians. Maybe the thing that's stopping us from being really good, is wasted time, lol.

Oh, if ever you said anything true, it is this. I wasted so much time gaming which I could have spent improving my guitar skills or writing novels. But you know what? Somehow I don't regret it. Those years I spend gaming, I enjoyed every second of them, I was living my life those years, and I think they are worth all the time and money I plunked on them.



The problem right now, is that artistry is way behind the technical abilities. Kojima might be a talented game developer, but he sucks balls as a storyteller.

I have to disagree with this one, MGS1 had an excellent story and characters, and it was told very well.


Man, imagine a Stanley Kubrick in charge of directing a game or a Steven Spielberg. That's why when I look at nintendo, I just kind of go, who cares, because I know for nintendo, these guys don't give a flying eff about turning gaming into a storytelling mediium.

Nintendo doesn't have this in their cards, but that's where Sony steps in. Of all the platforms, Sony has the strongest base for this sort of thing. Personally I do also think gaming is still a little immature as a story-telling medium but even so I've walked away from a lot of games having taken away a great story-based experience. Metal Gear Solid, Suikoden II, Zone of Enders 2, Super Robot Wars Alpha Gaiden, and hey even Ninja Gaiden 1 back in the day blew my socks off for story-telling.

Personally I think there are games where storytelling is worth recognizing, the problem is that, being such a young medium, most people don't take it seriously as a story-telling platform. I would wager that a lot of the critical acclaim for Spielberg or Kubrick films wouldn't be there if there wasn't an institution of critics that tells the public at large which films are masterpieces of story-telling. Since there is no such institution for videogames, a lot of worthy games get the short end of the stick. Gaming institutions usually award gameplay and graphics etc. but there are no "best story awards" or "best male character awards" and certainly even the critics rarely focus on these aspects, choosing to focus on other aspects of the game instead.

I think it's still seen as a childish or immature form for story-telling aspects and it is for this reason that they are not recognized, rather than any actual intrinsic lack of value.

[T.Tashi]

I tally my videogaming under entertainment expenses in Quicken. I while could see what amount and percentage I spend, I don't ever even look at it. Fortunately the market is so saturated, if I'm patient and willing to wait a few months, it's easy to get games way under $50.

Considering that I don't have a hi def TV, I have to ponder it if I want to take advantage of the full glory that next gen consoles will offer. When you start considering the visual and sounds, it gets more expensive than I want to think about.

I think the true definition of an addict is gaming 50 hours straight and dying. Or killing your friend because he sold your rare Dragon Star Sword for $900 real dollars. I'm probably at worst, a functional addict. Gaming doesn't interfere with other stuff in my life. But there's obviously a whole other level I just rather not know about.

One interesting thing I've noticed about how gaming has effected me. I have really sensitive peripheral vision.

I got curious and looked at spending at just one place: gamestop. $416 on the year.

[Jupiter_x]

Gaming is by no means a waste of time, as long as the experiance is enjoyable! Like Mochan said, I enjoy every minute of gaming. Now some games are terrable and I don't even waste my time. I'm a gamer for life!

My gaming purchases, decisions and tastes have changed over time, I don't just buy a game because it's popular or inexpensive. I buy only what I know I will truly enjoy. This Gen has been big for me in terms of abundance. I have all three systems including a DS and a PC. As Gadfly said " will have no problem buying fewer games and systems this time, and I'm pretty sure I'll actually have a lot more fun gaming because of it." I am probably going with only one system and just enjoy what that system has, forget the rest of them! I just don't want to keep up with 3 consoles anymore!

[Gadfly2317]

I have to disagree with this one, MGS1 had an excellent story and characters, and it was told very well.

Nintendo doesn't have this in their cards, but that's where Sony steps in. Of all the platforms, Sony has the strongest base for this sort of thing. Personally I do also think gaming is still a little immature as a story-telling medium
Personally I think there are games where storytelling is worth recognizing, the problem is that, being such a young medium, most people don't take it seriously as a story-telling platform. I would wager that a lot of the critical acclaim for Spielberg or Kubrick films wouldn't be there if there wasn't an institution of critics that tells the public at large which films are masterpieces of story-telling. Since there is no such institution for videogames, a lot of worthy games get the short end of the stick. Gaming institutions usually award gameplay and graphics etc. but there are no "best story awards" or "best male character awards" and certainly even the critics rarely focus on these aspects, choosing to focus on other aspects of the game instead.

I think it's still seen as a childish or immature form for story-telling aspects and it is for this reason that they are not recognized, rather than any actual intrinsic lack of value.
Sure there are Best Story and Best Male actor awards; I know Gamespot has categories like that; so do some of the mags; gaming journalism definitely discusses great stories. As far as Spielberg adnd Kubrick--man, critics promote all kinds of brilliant stuff that remains in obscurity; Spielberg and Kubrick, nobody had to tell an audience how to feel about The Shining, Lolita, Jaws, or Close Encounters--those masterfully directed stories just reached out and grabbed people.

When it comes to game vs story, I'll take strong, fun addictive gameplay first any day, and I love a good story. The kind of storytelling Waco's talking about and using to take swipe's at Nintendo who "doesn't give a flip about telling a story"--you make a great story, and then die and have to start at your last check point, it kinda jerks you out of the story. I'm not 100% certain about how great gaming really is for storytelling, or how much I like the idea of hollywood aspirations.

That said, his dig at Nintendo is just one more stupid thing, despite the fact that as a GAME company they keep their eye on the ball--the essentials of gameplay. Nintendo got behind Eternal Darkness, one of the best stories I've ever seen in a game. The Thousand Year Door (Paper Mario 2) has an in-depth comedic story; no its not some formulaic emotionally manipulative piece of dreck like anything Spielberg's done the last ten years, but you'd have to be a true snob to say a story can't be good just because it is a comedy. Trace Memories tells a story. Metroid Prime tells a very interesting story in perhaps the best way possible--you live the story, the story is embedded and continuous, not chopped up in "cut-scenes to tell some story where the story is an excuse to go back to running around blasting crap until the next cut-scene." Come to think of it Pikmin's simple story was actually very touching, even if it wasn't an overt bunch of dramatically acted cut scenes--those opressed little critters evolving from the encounter with Olimar, and the great ending where they rise up against the larger bugs in the planet; gameplay all the way, great story is implicit and experienced, the way it should be, not spoonfed and told to you every checkpoint in a videoclip.

What types of fun challenging gameplay lend themselves to the kind of storytelling waco was talking about? That's where the story telling and gaming have issues--part is the story and part is the game and rare is the experience that makes it seemless between the two.

[Mochan]

I think that story-telling in a game is fundamentally different from story telling in a film. The obvious thing being that games are reactive to you, and you are in the story itself, as opposed to a film where you are just an outside observer watching on as things unfold. This means that, unless you decide to slavishly confine your audience to just pressing a button whenever the next slide needs to play, designing the story around the interactive experience is a lot harder.

Well enough of that, it's a rather complicated area to talk about and I'll leave that for some other thread.

I think though that Waco is expecting a kind of interactive-storytelling-gameplay. He doesn't want story just in the passive sense that we get from a Final Fantasy cutscene, he's looking for game denizens to be unfolding the story be reacting to him intelligently. Of course this will be very rudimentary even with today's technology, but it can be spiced up with scripting, and when put in the context of a larger passive story like you'd expect from a pre-made scripted cutscene, I think the results can be very good if a good director is at the helm.

[Fivespot]

What's worse than not being good is the thought of all that great gear you could have owned. (I only own one bragging piece: A 1956 Les Paul Special. I don't even have an amp right now, for christs sake, so I'm only playing my acoustic.)

Oooh. Ahhh. A '56 Les Paul - NICE GUITAR!

Don't be ashamed about having no amp. Real men play acoustics (at least thats what I'm saying since I'm currently playing with an acoustic act).

An interesting side note: The electric guitar was invented by Les Paul in Waukesha, WI (only a city away from where I live). A major highway was recently renamed Les Paul parkway in honor of this historic achievement. Everytime I go out and see my parents, I get to drive on Les Paul parkway. How cool is that?

[trebor]

See you, Fivespot, Monkey Man and myself, all budding musicians. Maybe the thing that's stopping us from being really good, is wasted time, lol.

You're not the only ones.

I actually used to play bass in a band, which in my biased opinion was really good. Maybe even great. We actually gigged around the cities and ended up playing at some bars where I had seen some of my favorite bands play, which to me was the highlight of my musical career. We wrote 90% of the music we played and had a really good thing going...for a while at least.

That was years ago, though. These days I don't even touch my bass anymore, it's kind of a shame actually, my calluses have gone soft even. I don't blame videogames for that - I blame my career. Gigging at night, not getting home till 4 AM was fine when I worked at night and could sleep in till noon everyday, but when you work a 8 - 5, Mon - Fri job, there is nothing that can appeal to me less then having to stay out that late. Perhaps that's a cop out, but nevertheless, when my band broke up, I didn't have the energy to find something new to play in - despite the fact that bass players are always in high demand.

Not that I'm a total gear-head, but in my basement right now there is: a Conklin Groove Tools 5-String electric bass, a SWR Workingman's 15", a Peavey 110 Minx, a BP8 Vacuum Tube Bass Preamp/Processor, a SM-57 mic, a SM-58 mic, a Didgeridoo, a Chavel 375 electric guitar (doesn't work), and a wide assortment of mic stands, guitar stands, and many misc. pieces. All collecting dust, unfortunately.

What does this have to do with videogames? Not much actually. I don't blame playing videogames in the least for leaving behind playing music, as I said before I blame my career. Suffice to say, getting home at quarter after 5 everyday doesn't lend itself to lugging my heavy ass equipment around to play in someone's stanky basement - especially since I'm so picky about my music that I won't just play in any old group just to play. But, what quarter after 5 everyday DOES lend itself to is playing videogames.

Although I'd be lying if I said I play videogames everyday. These days I've been going weeks at a time where I don't even boot up the Cube - and it's not because I don't have anything to play. If anything, I have a serious game buying addiction, so much so that I have more games now for my Cube then any other previous system combined. So why don't I play them then? I don't know honestly. I'm feeling burnt out on console games, just like TMG is.

I've taken up archery. I've taken up biking. So, I do have some physical activities for after work, but I don't bike or shoot arrows nearly enough. I watch the friggen' TV. Everyday.

So, for me, the biggest waste of time I'm dealing with is the television. What I probably should be doing is playing games, because at least then I'd be interacting with that big black box I sit in front of every day. I sure as hell spend enough money on games where I should be playing everyday, but maybe I'm attracted to the thought of buying new games more then the thought of playing those games.

To Waco, or his facsimile - perhaps you did find it funny when I found it important to save $20 on my DS. Perhaps you found it funny when I said I have a mortgage to pay. The thing you don't understand is that I probably already spent $100s on games in addition to buying that DS, plus a couple of games for it that month. I'm so addicted to buying games that I just sold some old perhipherals to buy a game I really didn't need - Killer 7 to be specific. Why did I buy it, when there are multiple new games coming out I want? I don't know, honestly. I had $8.75 in credit at EB and I didn't want to save it, so I bought the only title I was remotely interested in.

So, to answer the original topic of this thread, I've probably spent somewhere close to $1000, or more, in the last generation just on my Gamecube. I'm not going to even count my GBA, GBA/SP, and my DS. I don't regret that money for a second either, even if I haven't even played through all the games I've bought. I know I'm not going to be buying a next-gen console until there is an established victor, so stockpiling titles makes sense for me to keep me gaming well after Gamecube titles are officially dried up.

[Gadfly2317]

I think though that Waco is expecting a kind of interactive-storytelling-gameplay. He doesn't want story just in the passive sense that we get from a Final Fantasy cutscene, he's looking for game denizens to be unfolding the story be reacting to him intelligently. Of course this will be very rudimentary even with today's technology, but it can be spiced up with scripting, and when put in the context of a larger passive story like you'd expect from a pre-made scripted cutscene, I think the results can be very good if a good director is at the helm.

True. I thought Stranger's Wrath did an exceptional job balancing story and game, but it still was the basic formula of cut-scenes moving you to the next big shoot-out. There were nice little touches though in the game itself and in character comments that revealed the story. Currently it seems like comedy-tinged drama works better than straight drama.

Also, my biggest question is does the nature of gaming limit the kind of stories to be told? Heroic tales and war stories? That was the thing with Pikmin, it was a tale, really, of Darwin on the Beagle in the galapgos, done through the lens of stranded alien, observing and documenting the nature around him and coming to appreciate it; and to even alter its course. Really, this was pretty sublime stuff for gaming, as opposed to pulpy cliched spy stuff of the supposedly mature scripting in Splinter Cell. That's the thing about great story telling, even in written fiction--you show, rather than tell a story.

[Gadfly2317]

I'm so addicted to buying games that I just sold some old perhipherals to buy a game I really didn't need - Killer 7 to be specific. Why did I buy it, when there are multiple new games coming out I want? I don't know, honestly. I had $8.75 in credit at EB and I didn't want to save it, so I bought the only title I was remotely interested in.


Dude, I did the same thing; it had dropped to $29 and I just couldn't resist even though I was playing other things and wasn't going to buy anything new. It is COOL. I actually traded in my Psychonauts, unfinished, because it was so ho-hum (though rated 90%) and the low 80's or less scoring Killer 7, I was worried I might not like it, but dude, this game is so freaking out there twisted. Control takes a bit to get used to, but well worth it to experience this work of art.

This is an example of story telling in a game for Waco; it may not be the weepy sappy drama of Spielberg--but its the first I'm aware of that takes game to somewhere between film-noir, psychological horror, and the warped indie film debut of Darron Aronovsky's "Pi."

[trebor]

Dude, I did the same thing; it had dropped to $29 and I just couldn't resist even though I was playing other things and wasn't going to buy anything new. It is COOL. I actually traded in my Psychonauts, unfinished, because it was so ho-hum (though rated 90%) and the low 80's or less scoring Killer 7, I was worried I might not like it, but dude, this game is so freaking out there twisted. Control takes a bit to get used to, but well worth it to experience this work of art.

This is an example of story telling in a game for Waco; it may not be the weepy sappy drama of Spielberg--but its the first I'm aware of that takes game to somewhere between film-noir, psychological horror, and the warped indie film debut of Darron Aronovsky's "Pi."

Well, if Feel the Magic has taught me anything, it's that I'm into really off the charts, bizarro games these days. Maybe it's that they are so damn different that they feel very fresh.

Although, I shouldn't say "they" quite yet, since I haven't started playing Killer 7. I'm determined to finish Paper Mario 2, and maybe Prince of Persia 1, before I crack into a new game.

[Gadfly2317]

Well, if Feel the Magic has taught me anything, it's that I'm into really off the charts, bizarro games these days. Maybe it's that they are so damn different that they feel very fresh.

Although, I shouldn't say "they" quite yet, since I haven't started playing Killer 7. I'm determined to finish Paper Mario 2, and maybe Prince of Persia 1, before I crack into a new game.

I've put PM2 on hold again; I freaking love this game but its one I want to spend a ton of time with when I do sit down, so its easy to procrastinate it. Well, Killer 7 is a good acorn to be holding onto; if you don't go to any wild party, you should crack it open on Halloween.

Also, I noticed you said you weren't getting a next gen system until there is a victor. What did you mean by that? I'm not 100% on the Rev yet, but I know it will NOT be the victor; I'm primarily hoping to see enough games announced to make it worth my while. I know it will have fewer games, but my goal is to buy fewer, more original innovative games; and my favorite two franchises, Metroid and Zelda (and Pikmin if they make another one) aren't going to be anywhere else. Can't say an online SSBM would hurt, but I do hope there is a big focus on new stuff for the new hardware like they've done with DS. Add in b/c and being able to download classics, those are reasons that I'm leaning Rev despite sparse info.

Even Xbox360 and Ps3, I won't be looking for the victor, I'll be looking at the one with the most games that I just HAVE to play(I haven't ruled out getting 2 consoles, but definitely not 3.) If 360 gets some things that are irresistebly innovative (but that are not military realism like the very innovative and intersting Full Spectrum Warrior) I wouldn't rule out 360 over Ps3, though I know neither one will have me at launch. I do have reasons to think next gens more innovative titles will be on Ps3 rather 360, just like this gen, but we just can't know for sure yet. Waco's one good point--the 360 will have more time to get games out there for us to covet and then drop in price when the Ps3 launches.

[trebor]

Also, I noticed you said you weren't getting a next gen system until there is a victor. What did you mean by that? I'm not 100% on the Rev yet, but I know it will NOT be the victor; I'm primarily hoping to see enough games announced to make it worth my while. I know it will have fewer games, but my goal is to buy fewer, more original innovative games; and my favorite two franchises, Metroid and Zelda (and Pikmin if they make another one) aren't going to be anywhere else. Can't say an online SSBM would hurt, but I do hope there is a big focus on new stuff for the new hardware like they've done with DS. Add in b/c and being able to download classics, those are reasons that I'm leaning Rev despite sparse info.

Even Xbox360 and Ps3, I won't be looking for the victor, I'll be looking at the one with the most games that I just HAVE to play(I haven't ruled out getting 2 consoles, but definitely not 3.) If 360 gets some things that are irresistebly innovative (but that are not military realism like the very innovative and intersting Full Spectrum Warrior) I wouldn't rule out 360 over Ps3, though I know neither one will have me at launch. I do have reasons to think next gens more innovative titles will be on Ps3 rather 360, just like this gen, but we just can't know for sure yet. Waco's one good point--the 360 will have more time to get games out there for us to covet and then drop in price when the Ps3 launches.

I was thinking about that after I typed it. "Victor", I believe, was the wrong choice of words. I should have said "I'm waiting till the 3 systems are clearly established." Which truly makes more sense. It will be far easier to tell if a system will jive with me better after they are established, rather then one having the most sales.

But, if it's between the Xbox360 and the PS3, then honestly, I think the best choice will only be the victor. Publishers are going to be completely profit driven, so it stands to reason that the system with the highest sales will get the most games - even the weird, less then popular, creative games that you fancy. Aside from a handful of exclusives, the M$ and Sony systems won't really be delivering gaming that is too different from each other - they are going to be getting all the same ports and multiplats.

In the Revolution's case, waiting for it to be established will be the only way to tell if it will be worth putting down some money on it. I don't want to buy the wierd system with the funky controller if there isn't going to be anything new to play on it.

To "Waco's" point - there is a HUGE flaw in his reasoning. At this stage, he should know better to assume that any of the systems is a sure thing, it's a gamble to make decisions before you know all the facts. There is no guarantee that the 360 won't tank once the PS3 hits, and will thusly be regulated to the typical Xbox fair of endless FPS, racers, and Xtreeem Sports games. Without 100% b/c, the 360 won't even let you go back and play any older Xbox titles that differ too much from what he would have to choose from with the newer titles.

[Mochan]

Gaming stories surely are not limited by nature to hero epics and war stories. There's a Jap game called Kana Little Sister which is about you and your little sister who was born terminally ill. Great story. And then there are sports games! I don't know why people don't put stories in sports games! Sports are all about youth, passion, rivalries and hard work! What better setting for dramatic stories to be told?

I mean we'll always have our hero epics and war stories, but anyone who even just tries should be able to put a good story into a lot of other genres. And hey, a lot of war stories have just plain turd for stories, or practically no story to speak of (like Splinter Cell, Call of Duty, etc.)

[Mochan]

Yeah, the only thing I watch on TV on any kind of regular basis is Discovery Channel or National Geographic.

[Gadfly2317]

So, for me, the biggest waste of time I'm dealing with is the television. What I probably should be doing is playing games, because at least then I'd be interacting with that big black box I sit in front of every day.

You know, I recently vowed to spend MORE time watching TV; I'd chosen to have my cable off much of the year and just quit watching TV; I recently added back basic cable, which then advertisted a special deal on Hi-Def TV; so since I have an HDTV and was missing certain channels I went ahead and got it. I don't think this is a waste of time; I have recently found and fallen in love with Discovery HD Cinema, they show the most beautiful documentarys and nature films--it best shows off 1080i HD, the content is entertaining, and its not a waste of time because its educational.

That, and I'm glad have South Park back, too. It's also educational, and thus not a waste of time either.

[trebor]

You know, I recently vowed to spend MORE time watching TV; I'd chosen to have my cable off much of the year and just quit watching TV; I recently added back basic cable, which then advertisted a special deal on Hi-Def TV; so since I have an HDTV and was missing certain channels I went ahead and got it. I don't think this is a waste of time; I have recently found and fallen in love with Discovery HD Cinema, they show the most beautiful documentarys and nature films--it best shows off 1080i HD, the content is entertaining, and its not a waste of time because its educational.

That, and I'm glad have South Park back, too. It's also educational, and thus not a waste of time either.

Well, like most things, there needs to be balance and moderation.

Without my TV I wouldn't be able to watch my beloved Adult Swim anime and watch the few live-action shows that are worth my time. But what I really need to quit doing is constant flipping and settling - as in flipping around in boredom and settling on watching something I really don't need to waste my time on.

I have to say though, I've become addicted to HBO's Rome series. Excellent stuff, there.

[Gadfly2317]

Well, like most things, there needs to be balance and moderation.

Without my TV I wouldn't be able to watch my beloved Adult Swim anime and watch the few live-action shows that are worth my time. But what I really need to quit doing is constant flipping and settling - as in flipping around in boredom and settling on watching something I really don't need to waste my time on.

I have to say though, I've become addicted to HBO's Rome series. Excellent stuff, there.

Yeah, Rome was the tipping factor for getting full cable again, and the HD special I just couldn't pass it up since I have an HDTV now. (There's an HD-HBO as one of the 8 or 9 channels which are HD. Man, I can't wait for the day when all channels are HD.) One thing is that this package also has "On-Demand" which I'd never heard of. This helps ease urges for flipping because you can go in and a lot of content is there to just watch. Like Rome, we got our cable after like the third show had shown, but you can go back in with On-Demand and catch up on shows you missed. I watched a great Sundance channel documentary called "Bushes Brain" about Karl Rove; rather than something by chance happening to be broadcasting when you sit down in front of the TV, you can search for something you want to watch, and just watch it right there.

Maybe everyone already knows this exists, but its new to me. Personally, I wish ALL content were accessible this way; for instance I hate planning my Sunday nights around Simpsons; I just want to watch it when I feel like, without having to bother setting stuff to record. Actually, in the HDTV vs Blue Ray war, it has often been suggested that direct access to the entire industries movie catalog on a "pay-per-view" basis will win out over the disk format; it's not just Toshiba vs Sony, its the Cable companies also trying to cash in the HD Movie money, and after having content delivered this way, it's really the way to go.

[Gadfly2317]

Trebor, speaking of spending, addiction, and vowing not to pick up new titles, I just got a look at the IGN review of Battallion Wars for GC, and watch some more vid clips; I think this one may be impossible to ignore; nearly a 90% score and the description in the review describes exactly what I would have liked to see in the game; a story, intuitive controls of both squads and invidual vehicles (both land and air) with incredible physics. They compared the land vehicles to the Warthog. I'm not generally into military stuff, but this one kept the light-hearted atmosphere of the handheld cousins, yet appears to be a deeply rewarding and action packed strategy game.

Any Xbot's who've hung onto their 'Cube should check this one out. It sounds like great strategy and action that manages to not have the disgusting macho-pig BS you see in a more realism based military game. This though, is another game that should have been online. . .perhaps as much as any game Nintendo has put out this gen.

[trebor]

One thing is that this package also has "On-Demand" which I'd never heard of.

Oh man...you discovered why I've been glued to my TV since I got cable. On Demand is as addictive as Snickers bars deep-fried in cocaine and dipped in heroin. Well, maybe not as addictive as that, but it's damn addictive.

All I have to say is welcome to more TV content then you can possibly digest in one sitting. Anime, movies, HBO series, music, concerts, gaming news - it's all there to be had at the touch of a button.

I'm loving Rome at the moment. Titus Pollus alone makes the series worth watching. Best. Character. Ever.


Trebor, speaking of spending, addiction, and vowing not to pick up new titles, I just got a look at the IGN review of Battallion Wars for GC, and watch some more vid clips; I think this one may be impossible to ignore; nearly a 90% score and the description in the review describes exactly what I would have liked to see in the game; a story, intuitive controls of both squads and invidual vehicles (both land and air) with incredible physics. They compared the land vehicles to the Warthog. I'm not generally into military stuff, but this one kept the light-hearted atmosphere of the handheld cousins, yet appears to be a deeply rewarding and action packed strategy game.

Yeah, Battalion Wars looks like the perfect balance of frenetic twitch-based shooting and squad based strategy all wrapped up in a cute and cuddly shell. I was wondering why you claimed to be uninterested in it, seeing as how it's right down your alley.

Too bad about the lack of multiplayer, but it would be terrible on split screen anyways.

[Mochan]

Actually, in the HDTV vs Blue Ray war, it has often been suggested that direct access to the entire industries movie catalog on a "pay-per-view" basis will win out over the disk format;

This is how I do things right now.... except I do things "extra legally" if you take my drift.

[Fivespot]

I also have HD cable and the on-demand services. HBO on-demand is the BEST with the ability to watch any movie, special, and series whenever you want. I never have to worry about missing an episode of Curb - I can always catch it later on I-Control (Time Warner cable's version of the on-demand).

I also have the HD DVR which is a nice compliment to the on-demand.

The DVR requires some forethought. Re: watching the Simpsons whenever - DVR allows me to do that and to be honest, I couldn't live without it. My wife and I use the DVR constantly and very rarely watch a show when it airs.

DVR stands for Digital Video Recorder in case you aren't sure what the heck I'm talking about here. Its a similar product to TiVo.

[theWacoKid]

And if MGS4 has the kind of gameplay experience we saw in the trailer, it'll also easily be one of the most intense experiences around. .

If the game is like that trailer, I'll be asleep with my controller in hand.

[Zilla Man]

Dude, I did the same thing; it had dropped to $29 and I just couldn't resist even though I was playing other things and wasn't going to buy anything new. It is COOL. I actually traded in my Psychonauts, unfinished, because it was so ho-hum (though rated 90%) and the low 80's or less scoring Killer 7, I was worried I might not like it, but dude, this game is so freaking out there twisted. Control takes a bit to get used to, but well worth it to experience this work of art.

You actually traded in Psychonauts before finishing it?

I was going to wait until it dropped to $30 and pick it up for the Xbox (the PS2 is nearly identical except for textures and load times). But if someone like you (who shares my taste for eccentric games) didn't like it, I'm worried. :(

Seriously, what turned you off about it? Or was it just an impulse trade-in?

On that note, I'll definitely be getting Stranger's Wrath before the end of the year (probably when it hits $20 used). The Xbox quirky titles are starting to get get cheap now.

[Gadfly2317]

You actually traded in Psychonauts before finishing it?

I was going to wait until it dropped to $30 and pick it up for the Xbox (the PS2 is nearly identical except for textures and load times). But if someone like you (who shares my taste for eccentric games) didn't like it, I'm worried. :(

Seriously, what turned you off about it? Or was it just an impulse trade-in?

On that note, I'll definitely be getting Stranger's Wrath before the end of the year (probably when it hits $20 used). The Xbox quirky titles are starting to get get cheap now.

First, the level designs are really beautiful, psychedelic and original, mostly. There were wire hopping things ripped right out of Mario Sunshine without the great physics. It was also really "kiddy" and I know that may seem like an odd thing coming from me; but stuff that I like may be cute but not particularly kiddy. This one was kiddy like as in adolescent, and excessively chatty, too much boring dialogue and long load times.

And the originality was all in the graphics and not in the gameplay, mostly. It was a bump-ass platformer, and I was really coveting the film-noir twisted psycho-sexual terrorist depravity blood and guts that is Killer 7. It's not that psychonauts was bad, or that wasn't in many ways an excellent game, it just wasn't right for Gaddy Sept 2005.

Stranger's Wrath on the other hand, I've probably over built it, and maybe it was fresh to me because I don't do FPS's that often, but this was a real hybrid game with really fun game play and a great story. I played this mo-fo nearly straight through to the end, and that's rare; I'm a pokey gamer normally.

[Mochan]

Psychonauts looks like it had some really BAD graphics. I never even considered picking it up for any platform, but this decision was based on the shallow angle of ugly graphics.

[Gadfly2317]

Psychonauts looks like it had some really BAD graphics. I never even considered picking it up for any platform, but this decision was based on the shallow angle of ugly graphics.

Did you ever see the final game running, especially on Xbox? Artistically, the graphics were extremely cool; technically, they were ok to mediocre, but far from bad.

[trebor]

I also have HD cable and the on-demand services. HBO on-demand is the BEST with the ability to watch any movie, special, and series whenever you want. I never have to worry about missing an episode of Curb - I can always catch it later on I-Control (Time Warner cable's version of the on-demand).

I also have the HD DVR which is a nice compliment to the on-demand.

The DVR requires some forethought. Re: watching the Simpsons whenever - DVR allows me to do that and to be honest, I couldn't live without it. My wife and I use the DVR constantly and very rarely watch a show when it airs.

DVR stands for Digital Video Recorder in case you aren't sure what the heck I'm talking about here. Its a similar product to TiVo.

That's my setup almost exactly, except I have Comcast instead of Time Warner. It's funny how my wife and I didn't really ever think we needed a DVR either, but now that we have it we can't live without it. Being able to fast forward through commercials is enough of a benefit alone, but we have quite a bit of stuff saved up. I've got Samurai Champloo episodes 1 - 12 saved up, as well as a huge chunk of Paranoia Agent that we still need to watch.

Another thing that is great about digital cable is that you can pause/rewind/fast forward live TV, so if you hit pause when a show starts and wait 5 minutes you can essentially fast forward through most of the commericals while you watch.

[Mochan]

Did you ever see the final game running, especially on Xbox? Artistically, the graphics were extremely cool; technically, they were ok to mediocre, but far from bad.

Admittedly I haven't seen the final game running, I know it's out on the PC as well; but the reason I don't like the graphics is *because* of the artistic design. I just don't like the design. It reminds me of 2000-era American cartoon caricatures, which I have to admit I have a distaste for.