Xbox has RPG of the year on LOCKDOWN [Archive]

Gaming Geezer 78

09-01-2003, 07:53 PM

If I didn't have Xbox, I'd be getting KOTOR on PC. This game in absolutely incredible. I can't complain at all about it. I pity the FF series because all it has left is cg...gamers shouldn't want simplistic linear video story books anymore. Xbox keeps ruining it for everyone else for all genres...DOA3 kills all the fighting genre(graphically, style), Halo kills all the FPS genre(except RTCW that is), and the Moto Gps online kill all the racers, now KOTOR buries all other console RPGs.

Quality > Quantity = the power of X.

Dead or Alive 3 is all graphics, graphics, graphics. I cannot argue that it is the best looking fighter from a purely technical standpoint, but I can argue that the art style, presentation, character designs and overall design in games like Soul Calibur II, Tekken 4 and Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution are better. I can argue that the gameplay in all of these games is more elaborate, balanced and fun than DOA3. And that's what makes a game great-the gameplay. It's funny how you Xbots keep talking about Graphics, graphics, graphics. Is that all you have to argue in DOA3's defense? Why not comment about the lame end-boss? Why not comment on the lack of in-game cinemas when Xbox is supposed to be "all-powerful?"

Knights of the Old Republic is a good RPG, but far from the best. The game is pretty linear. You can only wander so much and you have a set story to play through. The endings basically suck, the framerate chugs all the time for no apparent reasons, the memory card save requirements are outrageous and the game lacks visual polish. Your AI buddies (two partners who go with you at any given time) are morons who cannot follow orders. I tell them to stay put while I sneak past the Rancor, what do they do? Here they come running and get their asses killed. But wait-nobody actually dies! They just get up after the battle with 1 hit-point left!

What's funny is that EGM named Soul Calibur II "game of the month" over KOTOR. All Xbots have to brag about are ports of PC titles and a few good exclusives. But then again, good exclusives to Xbots and their fanboy magazines & sites is graphics first/gameplay second.

Tappy_Tibbons

09-02-2003, 01:07 AM

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Knights of the Old Republic is a good RPG, but far from the best. The game is pretty linear. You can only wander so much and you have a set story to play through. The endings basically suck, the framerate chugs all the time for no apparent reasons, the memory card save requirements are outrageous and the game lacks visual polish. Your AI buddies (two partners who go with you at any given time) are morons who cannot follow orders. I tell them to stay put while I sneak past the Rancor, what do they do? Here they come running and get their asses killed. But wait-nobody actually dies! They just get up after the battle with 1 hit-point left!

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far from the best? what IS the best then geezer? Just curious...

Renzatic Gear

09-02-2003, 07:22 AM

Pfft. Nothing beats the Fallout series when it comes to good, honest, deep gameplay.

What other game lets you make a porno while you're pimping your wife out on the street to pay for your ingame drug addiction?

VGV

09-02-2003, 08:34 AM

<div class=\"smallfont\">Dead or Alive 3 is all graphics, graphics, graphics. I cannot argue that it is the best looking fighter from a purely technical standpoint, but I can argue that the art style, presentation, character designs and overall design in games like Soul Calibur II, Tekken 4 and Virtua Fighter 4 Evolution are better. I can argue that the gameplay in all of these games is more elaborate, balanced and fun than DOA3. And that's what makes a game great-the gameplay. It's funny how you Xbots keep talking about Graphics, graphics, graphics.</div>

Hiya Cyberdine...at first glance DOA3's fighting engine may seem shallow, at least that's the experience I had when first sinking my teeth into the DC incarnation...but after spending a fair amount of time with this fighter I'm amazed by the <i>incredibly deep</i> undocumented (at least I haven't read about it anywhere) treasure chest this baby contains.

Let me illustrate by taking Ayane (fave character) as an example...somehow she has a weird "move" where she stands still for a few <i>precious</i> seconds and says a "prayer" in japanese...somehow after she does this it seems, to me at least, that she's capable of pulling off the most spectacular moves...trust me, during this time she'll put up quite a show.

But here's the thing that truly <i>blew</i> me away about DOA3's fighting engine...the fighting engine's responsiveness is of such high degree, it will allow you to create your own moves...I'm not talking stringing together existing moves (commonly referred to as combo), but stringing together <i>parts</i> of moves and thus creating your own undocumeted move...my fave is Ayane's <i>slithering snake</i> move (as I call it)...she'll crawl over the floor at a blazingly fast pace, while you have total control over her direction (left,right,forward,diagonally) towards her opponent (on her back, while it's not touching the ground, for during this time she moves on her hands and feet). During this time your opponent cannot harm Ayane for she's <i>untouchable</i>...and here's the blast...when close enough to your opponent's feet, you decide how spectacular the offensive finish will be...I prefer the <i>vertical rocket in yer face</i> move (as I call it)

P.S. can't give any input on KOTOR yet...just started playing this one a few days ago...but I like eet mucho mucho !!!

folken001

09-02-2003, 12:07 PM

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blah!

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You are probably one of few people actually find depth in DOA3's fighting engine. It is such a surprise to me, because DOA3 has no depth. Creating your own move in DOA3? You can do the same with all the games that has side steps. It is not really called creating your own moves, it is more applications of the moves.

Easy and simple, there is no depth in DOA3. If there was, u would see tournments for it. The matter of fact is, there isn't any in Japan or U.S. That should tell you something.....

I am not attacking your personal reference however, I know quite of few people who like to play this game to kill their time. After all, it has some eye candies. However, as far as depth of this games goes, it has none.

folken001

09-02-2003, 12:08 PM

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Quality > Quantity = the power of X. </div>

50 + millions > 10 million = the power of PS2.

As far as quality, I think it's all opinion. The numbers don't lie, however.

Tappy_Tibbons

09-02-2003, 12:19 PM

see, no one still has anything to say about an RPG beating out KOTOR. FFX-2 will be as all the other FF games are...linear. Everyone sees the same cinemas, big deal right? Everyone is on the same path in FF games.

Doa3 is getting more recognition than it's worth as well. Not a bad game IMO but nothing special about it other than it is the best looking game there is.

folken001

09-02-2003, 12:26 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">see, no one still has anything to say about an RPG beating out KOTOR. FFX-2 will be as all the other FF games are...linear. Everyone sees the same cinemas, big deal right? Everyone is on the same path in FF games.

Doa3 is getting more recognition than it's worth as well. Not a bad game IMO but nothing special about it other than it is the best looking game there is.</div>

I think disgaea is pretty good. It is more of a strategy RPG though. Don't know it counts or not.

Linear game is just as good as non-linear. It's more about reference than quality.

VGV

09-02-2003, 01:34 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>
Creating your own move in DOA3? You can do the same with all the games that has side steps.</div>

Um...folken do you know what I'm talking about ? Judging by your response...nope. First of all side stepping = left, right movement around a 3D fighting arena. So you're telling me that move X,side step right, move Y, side step left = new move (LOL!).

Let me put it this way : move X 1/5 through + move X 3/5 through + move Y 3/4 through = new move. Why ? because move X 1/5 through <> (doesn't equal) move X.

P.S. when I mention move X 1/5 through + move Y 2/4 through...I mean the sequence is uninterrupted...as in seamlessly

Gaming Geezer 78

09-02-2003, 02:19 PM

Hiya Cyberdine...at first glance DOA3's fighting engine may seem shallow, at least that's the experience I had when first sinking my teeth into the DC incarnation...but after spending a fair amount of time with this fighter I'm amazed by the incredibly deep undocumented (at least I haven't read about it anywhere) treasure chest this baby contains.

Let me illustrate by taking Ayane (fave character) as an example...somehow she has a weird "move" where she stands still for a few precious seconds and says a "prayer" in japanese...somehow after she does this it seems, to me at least, that she's capable of pulling off the most spectacular moves...trust me, during this time she'll put up quite a show.

But here's the thing that truly blew me away about DOA3's fighting engine...the fighting engine's responsiveness is of such high degree, it will allow you to create your own moves...I'm not talking stringing together existing moves (commonly referred to as combo), but stringing together parts of moves and thus creating your own undocumeted move...my fave is Ayane's slithering snake move (as I call it)...she'll crawl over the floor at a blazingly fast pace, while you have total control over her direction (left,right,forward,diagonally) towards her opponent (on her back, while it's not touching the ground, for during this time she moves on her hands and feet). During this time your opponent cannot harm Ayane for she's untouchable...and here's the blast...when close enough to your opponent's feet, you decide how spectacular the offensive finish will be...I prefer the vertical rocket in yer face move (as I call it)

P.S. can't give any input on KOTOR yet...just started playing this one a few days ago...but I like eet mucho mucho !!!

Please, don't get me wrong. I own DOA on PSOne, DOA2 on Dreamcast and DOA3 & Volleyball on Xbox. I love playing these games. This entire arguement stems from Daman aka TheMaskedGamer saying that Soul Calibur II is a shallow piece of crap with a lousy end-boss, bad graphics and crap play modes. He has obviously not played the game or put little more than a few minutes into the straight-forward arcade mode.

As a fellow gamer and someone who has obviously played DOA3, could I not attack Daman in the game with standard attacks, avoid his reversals without blocking and basically whip him using Christie's "poke your eye out" punch a few times, a simple grab and throw with the A-button and a double-kick with the R-trigger?

The entire thing is that DOA3 is not the greatest fighter ever. While it is a good fighting series with outstanding graphical polish, this doesn't necessarily equate to a better looking game. Style has alot to do with it. I don't really get pissed, but I do hate when an ignorant person speaks of things they no absolutely zero about. Like Daman saying that every SCII fighter has a "double" that is basically just the same guy with two different names & looks. Or saying that DOA3 is more "realistic." Since Soul Calibur II is set in a fantasy world, suspension of disbelief is easier. But in DOA3 when someone gets thrown a few stories head-first out a window, through a neon sign and cracks their skull on the pavement and gets back up fighting...well, let's just say that is far from realistic.

If you notice, neither Daman or Tappy Tibbons who have both openly criticized SCII having obviously not played the games has responded to my comments on either SCII or DOA3. Another few "ownings" and Daman will disappear once again for a few months, come back with a new sign-on name and talk more crap-having complete amnesia about losing an arguement.

folken001

09-02-2003, 03:55 PM

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Um...folken do you know what I'm talking about ? Judging by your response...nope. First of all side stepping = left, right movement around a 3D fighting arena. So you're telling me that move X,side step right, move Y, side step left = new move (LOL!).

Let me put it this way : move X 1/5 through + move X 3/5 through + move Y 3/4 through = new move. Why ? because move X 1/5 through <> (doesn't equal) move X.

P.S. when I mention move X 1/5 through + move Y 2/4 through...I mean the sequence is uninterrupted...as in seamlessly</div>

That is what your trick sounded like to me. A little variation of the move doesn't make it a new move and definitely not make a game deeper. Not even mention if the move was created to have the user to have the freedom to control its motion to begin with. Hwoarang has a move where you do two kicks then you can finish with high, low kicks, or side step then kick, or you can just cancel it. How about Misurugi in SC2 can hold his sword and change his stance then move around left and right. Are those new moves too?

Whaxx

09-02-2003, 03:55 PM

Well, fighters, as a videogame genre, were never that strong at all, well at least compared to FPS's, RPG's, Racers.....at least DOA 3 brought out a strengh in a fighter which is the graphics.

slade

09-02-2003, 03:59 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">Well, fighters, as a videogame genre, were never that strong at all, well at least compared to FPS's, RPG's, Racers.....at least DOA 3 brought out a strengh in a fighter which is the graphics.</div>

Fighters single handedly kept the arcade scene alive through the early to late nineties.

And sorry, but fighting games were among the best looking games on any console back in the day. The very first game that was lauded on PSX for having tremendous graphics was Toshinden, a fighting game.

Whaxx

09-02-2003, 04:03 PM

I'm not talking about arcade, bud.

trebor

09-02-2003, 04:12 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">Pfft. Nothing beats the Fallout series when it comes to good, honest, deep gameplay.

What other game lets you make a porno while you're pimping your wife out on the street to pay for your ingame drug addiction?</div>

Ahhh..the Fallout series, now those were the great RPG grandaddy's of them all. Fallout 1+2 are basically the precursers to my beloved Baldur's Gate series, as well as Neverwinter Nights and these Xboyz's KotOR.

I'd love to see one of these schmucks who goes on and on about KotOR's "replayability" and "non-linear gameplay" have a shot at either Fallout or Fallout 2. First, they would lose interest immediately because of the ancient graphics engine. Then they would be lost, because there is TOO many options to choose from as far as what kind of character to play, or what to do first.

You can actually get through all of Fallout without killing anybody, except 1 certain antagonist. The Xboyz ADD patrol wouldn't like that whatsoever.

slade

09-02-2003, 04:12 PM

I'm not talking about arcade, bud.

No, you were talking about videogames. How could I say videogames and arcade games in the same sentence. OMG, teh horror teh horror. :rolleyes:

Anyways, you want console examples, look at games like Mortal Kombat which reinforced Sega's reputation during the Genesis/SNES years. Not letting blood into the SNES version of the game was a mistake that haunted Nintendo and is considered somewhat of a precursor of the whole, 'Nintendo is for teh kitties,' spokesline.

NTM, that when Sega was getting spanked by Sony and PSX, their big comeback was a remixed version of Virtua Fighter 2. And what helped Sony gain ground on Sega, Tekken.

Finally, Toshinden has nothing to do with the arcades.

"The Game"Evolution

09-02-2003, 04:54 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">RPG of the year? Get the hell outta here!!!! The FF series totally squashed KOTOR. And I don't even know what KOTOR stands for! That just proves how X-box failed to commercialize its games.

DOA 3 = crap

Def Jam Vendetta > DOA 3

Why? Better graphics, better gameplay and better sounds along with cool music

Halo was ok but it was too easy to beat. Halo fails to take the # 1 place of console FPS.

Moto GPS is a friggin' joke!!!! How old are you, Sissy_Ribbons? Six? Seven? You need to play more racing games.

Quality > Quantity = the power of Sony</div>

First off KOTOR stands for:Star Wars Knights Of The Old Republic.The Game currently on the Xbox and soon on the PC.Perhaps the best RPG currently of 2003.

Besides the latest FF is only available to anyone that has the import Sony HDD.In case you didnt know.And FF X-2 wont be out to about the end of this year.Enjoy playing FF X-2:Full Throttle.A whole bunch of girl power flunkies following Luna around sure sounds exciting.(NOT!)

So you are saying that Def Jam Vendetta is better than DOA 3? LOL! A typical ignorant New York response.DJV is not in DOA3's league.From graphics to gameplay.

Plus we all know that Halo is the undisputed king of console FPS's.Nothing on the PS2 or the GC can match it or beat it.And no we are not including PC games either.We are talking about the Xbox,the GC,and the PS2 only.

And why is MOTOGP a joke? Because its on the Xbox? Or is it because its online? Well what Motocycle game is online playable on the PS2?(crickets churping) I guess you have no answer to that then.Like I thought.

Of course you are a Pro-Sony "Neomaxizoomdreebie" Fragmaster.But next time if you are going to debate something make sure you um bring something to the table first.Smell you later Fragmaster.

Fragmastar

09-02-2003, 04:58 PM

^^^^
Wow

You've convinced me that I'm wrong. I guess X-box can pull off some pretty strong jabs.

Smell ya later, Triple H fan ("The Game" Evolution)

"The Game"Evolution

09-02-2003, 05:00 PM

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You are probably one of few people actually find depth in DOA3's fighting engine. It is such a surprise to me, because DOA3 has no depth. Creating your own move in DOA3? You can do the same with all the games that has side steps. It is not really called creating your own moves, it is more applications of the moves.

Easy and simple, there is no depth in DOA3. If there was, u would see tournments for it. The matter of fact is, there isn't any in Japan or U.S. That should tell you something.....

I am not attacking your personal reference however, I know quite of few people who like to play this game to kill their time. After all, it has some eye candies. However, as far as depth of this games goes, it has none.</div>

Just about every fighting game has a certain amount of depth to it.Only gamers that wants to learn each and every move to each and every available fighter inside a fighting game can lay claim to what does and what doesnt have the most depth.And you Folken hasnt done that with DOA3.Plus I dare anyone out there to name me a RPG thats soon to be released on any console that will be above what KOTOR has brought to the table on the Xbox.By all means fellow gamers that dont believe give me some feedback on this.

folken001

09-02-2003, 06:14 PM

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Just about every fighting game has a certain amount of depth to it.Only gamers that wants to learn each and every move to each and every available fighter inside a fighting game can lay claim to what does and what doesnt have the most depth.And you Folken hasnt done that with DOA3.Plus I dare anyone out there to name me a RPG thats soon to be released on any console that will be above what KOTOR has brought to the table on the Xbox.By all means fellow gamers that dont believe give me some feedback on this.</div>

By what you are saying here, there is no crappy games, because they all have certain amount of depth to them. In tha sense, The Bouncer was a great game indeed, was it not?

I've heard good things about KOTOR, but no one has shown me what makes this game the GOTY. If this games get GOTY with the same reason as how Balder's Gate got its, I don't think I would care too much....

Gaming Geezer 78

09-02-2003, 08:47 PM

No, you were talking about videogames. How could I say videogames and arcade games in the same sentence. OMG, teh horror teh horror. :rolleyes:

Anyways, you want console examples, look at games like Mortal Kombat which reinforced Sega's reputation during the Genesis/SNES years. Not letting blood into the SNES version of the game was a mistake that haunted Nintendo and is considered somewhat of a precursor of the whole, 'Nintendo is for teh kitties,' spokesline.

NTM, that when Sega was getting spanked by Sony and PSX, their big comeback was a remixed version of Virtua Fighter 2. And what helped Sony gain ground on Sega, Tekken.

Finally, Toshinden has nothing to do with the arcades.

That's almost as bad as saying Xbox games are PC games. You aren't going to convince Whaxx/Whoop, Daman "click, whirrr...." or any of these other fools.

"Game" even tries to say DOA3 is as "deep" as Virtua Fighter 4 and that you can mash your way through VF4! LOFL! And he is still saying that Soul Calibur on Dreamcast looks better than SCII. Notice I shut Tappy & Daman's mouths on that one.

Tappy_Tibbons

09-03-2003, 12:13 AM

<div class=\"smallfont\">That's almost as bad as saying Xbox games are PC games. You aren't going to convince Whaxx/Whoop, Daman "click, whirrr...." or any of these other fools.

"Game" even tries to say DOA3 is as "deep" as Virtua Fighter 4 and that you can mash your way through VF4! LOFL! And he is still saying that Soul Calibur on Dreamcast looks better than SCII. Notice I shut Tappy & Daman's mouths on that one.</div>

Hey Geezer, guess what...the topic of this frikkin thread is NOT SC2. It's about RPGs. Geez, can't you read? Every topic is SC this SC that, screw that. This might as well not even be system wars anymore...call it the Soul Calibur 2 whining board or something to better suit what it is. I'll be glad when people realize what a moronic bunch they have turned into and STFU about SC2! SORRY BUT IT'S NOT AS GOOD AS YOU TRY AND MAKE IT OUT TO BE! And what does it have to do with system wars? Everyone is arguing about a FRIKKIN MULTIPLAT GAME!!! WTF?!

slade

09-03-2003, 05:24 AM

<div class=\"smallfont\">That's almost as bad as saying Xbox games are PC games. You aren't going to convince Whaxx/Whoop, Daman "click, whirrr...." or any of these other fools.

"Game" even tries to say DOA3 is as "deep" as Virtua Fighter 4 and that you can mash your way through VF4! LOFL! And he is still saying that Soul Calibur on Dreamcast looks better than SCII. Notice I shut Tappy & Daman's mouths on that one.</div>

Yeah, I know I'm not going to convince them but enough hammering and maybe the point might just get through. Whoop hasn't responded since I posted, maybe I got through.

Moody's opinion on fighters is just plain retarded. There's a reason why he lost 4 nothing to Folken.

ThaMaskedGamer

09-03-2003, 05:46 AM

about what happened in a different thread...you are one shameless *ahem* person. Just because I don't live in here all day long like you, doesn't mean you shut anyone up. Plus, as usual, you never answered any of the points of debate. All you do is run and post quotes from reviews, cause you don't play any of the games you talk crap about.
Moody was right, almost, SC2 does look better than SC, but they look the same save for the 3D backgrounds which contribute little to the game. SOME SOME of the costumes are different, but they aren't better. The characters with the same costumes look darn near identical, even in progressive mode, which is something you have never seen i'm sure.
You are a complete waste of space, u claim VF4 is deep true, but then u claim SC2 is deep which is crap. SC2 is one of the easiest button mashers you can play, DOA3 is much closer to VF4 in depth than SC2 is to DOA3. But hey, i'm wasting my breath, mister "MS is EVIL and we can't let them take over videogames, they are trying to get a monopoly in gaming and our games will suck like Windows does, whaaaaah!" Anything on XBOX is crap according to you, sure Slade the levels in SC2 are much better than DOA3, by not even admitting the obvious you work against yourself.

slade

09-03-2003, 06:04 AM

And yet apparently here you are, Daman. Apparently, my goading worked. :cool:

I've already answered just about every question you had in that other thread. Truthfully, I don't even think you should be talking about which fighting games have depth or not since your exposure to the genre began with the Dreamcast.

Tappy_Tibbons

09-03-2003, 08:40 AM

and MS isn't evil...it's not like Bill Gates invented the frikkin barcode!

Sorry, but I don't see anything wrong with standardization which MS is king of. Maybe it's worse for the little guy or maybe the little guy should STRIVE TO DO BETTER...just a thought.

VGV

09-03-2003, 09:02 AM

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>That is what your trick sounded like to me. A little variation of the move doesn't make it a new move and definitely not make a game deeper. Not even mention if the move was created to have the user to have the freedom to control its motion to begin with. Hwoarang has a move where you do two kicks then you can finish with high, low kicks, or side step then kick, or you can just cancel it. How about Misurugi in SC2 can hold his sword and change his stance then move around left and right. Are those new moves too?</div>

Nah, what I'm talking about goes a <i>bit</i> deeper than that. Maybe the best way to settle this is for me to share a little secret with you, that you could try out to undestand me better. I'll give you one that isn't too difficult (not because I doubt your skill, but because it's easier to describe with words), but very effective, very cool to watch and um...very cheap (if you use it, you will pull off easy victories over your opponents...when I use this move people just put down their controller and watch me humiliate them...that's why I stopped using it).

In the DC version of <i>Soul Calibur</i> choose <i>Yoshimitsu</i> as your character. During the fight make him pull off a <i>documented</i> move where he'll "hop" onto his sword. The move isn't supposed to this, but if you time it correctly, each and every time the tip of his sword (which has now become the lowest point of impact and is facing straight down vertically) lifts an inch from the ground just tap the A button.

If you keep doing and timing this correctly, you'll get him to hover so high above his opponent and arena, that the camera's zoom-out is of such extremities, you'll actually get a bird's eye view of both (you'll never see <i>Kilik</i> tinier than that). This means of course that now <i>Yoshimitsu's</i> literally <i>flying</i> around and has total control over his flight path.

What I do then is the following...watch my opponent helplessly run around the arena slashing, hacking, kicking in thin air...for I'm out of reach...I'll keep following him airbound, keeping the top of his/her head as my lock-on target...slowly lower my altitude until I land straight on his/her highest point of impact (aka head)...when this is done he/she will be lying flat on the floor...time to start flying again.

P.S. Fun to do maybe once or twice, but during fights I prefer to win the <i>hard</i> way, not the <i>cheap</i> way.

"The Game"Evolution

09-05-2003, 11:12 PM

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By what you are saying here, there is no crappy games, because they all have certain amount of depth to them. In tha sense, The Bouncer was a great game indeed, was it not?

I've heard good things about KOTOR, but no one has shown me what makes this game the GOTY. If this games get GOTY with the same reason as how Balder's Gate got its, I don't think I would care too much....</div>

First off we are talking about fighting games like DOA3,Tekken,Guilty Gear X,VF4,Soul Calibur II.The Bouncer was simply put:A STREETS OF RAGE WANNABE THAT FELL FLATTER THAN JUSTINE-HENIN-HARDIENE'S BREASTS.Streets Of Rage on the Genesis is still ten times better than that overhyped piece of trash that was on the PS2.

Now back to what I was saying:Just about every fighting game has depth.With most fighters there are tons of moves that most gamers dont even use or even knew existed.That goes for any fighting game.Wheter a certain fighting game is crappy or not doesnt change the fact that there isnt any depth to it.

KOTOR Folken is a great RPG.For any gamer that claims to love RPG's this game indeed is for them.If you were to play this game with an open mind you'll come to find that this game indeed is just as good as any other RPG that you'll play on the PS2 or the PC.And if you are a Star Wars fan then you'll really fall hard for this game.Looking into the remainder of this year I dont see any upcoming RPG's thats coming for the PS2 or the GC that'll give this RPG a run for its money really.

I mean to be able to determine the fate of a Galaxy in the palm of your hands is as good as it gets 001.I mean in your eyes what RPG on the PS2 or the GC for this year stands a chance to upseat KOTOR for RPG of the year for 2003? From what I'm standing I dont see anything as a threat.Nothing at all.

folken001

09-06-2003, 08:25 AM

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Nah, what I'm talking about goes a <i>bit</i> deeper than that. Maybe the best way to settle this is for me to share a little secret with you, that you could try out to undestand me better. I'll give you one that isn't too difficult (not because I doubt your skill, but because it's easier to describe with words), but very effective, very cool to watch and um...very cheap (if you use it, you will pull off easy victories over your opponents...when I use this move people just put down their controller and watch me humiliate them...that's why I stopped using it).

In the DC version of <i>Soul Calibur</i> choose <i>Yoshimitsu</i> as your character. During the fight make him pull off a <i>documented</i> move where he'll "hop" onto his sword. The move isn't supposed to this, but if you time it correctly, each and every time the tip of his sword (which has now become the lowest point of impact and is facing straight down vertically) lifts an inch from the ground just tap the A button.

If you keep doing and timing this correctly, you'll get him to hover so high above his opponent and arena, that the camera's zoom-out is of such extremities, you'll actually get a bird's eye view of both (you'll never see <i>Kilik</i> tinier than that). This means of course that now <i>Yoshimitsu's</i> literally <i>flying</i> around and has total control over his flight path.

What I do then is the following...watch my opponent helplessly run around the arena slashing, hacking, kicking in thin air...for I'm out of reach...I'll keep following him airbound, keeping the top of his/her head as my lock-on target...slowly lower my altitude until I land straight on his/her highest point of impact (aka head)...when this is done he/she will be lying flat on the floor...time to start flying again.

P.S. Fun to do maybe once or twice, but during fights I prefer to win the <i>hard</i> way, not the <i>cheap</i> way.</div>

I know somewhat about SC2, know quite much about tekken, but I don't know enough about DOA3. I don't really care though. I only thought that because the way you described. I use parry/counter a lot in tekken and SC2. That is basically my main strategy and I add some additional variation to it.

"The Game"Evolution

09-06-2003, 09:08 AM

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By what you are saying here, there is no crappy games, because they all have certain amount of depth to them. In tha sense, The Bouncer was a great game indeed, was it not?

I've heard good things about KOTOR, but no one has shown me what makes this game the GOTY. If this games get GOTY with the same reason as how Balder's Gate got its, I don't think I would care too much....</div>

The Bouncer was a great game? LOL! Yeah like a check it bounced alright!This game was nothing more than a Streets Of Rage wannabe that truly didnt live up to the hype.No real weapons,no blood,no interactive backgrounds,and if you skipped the cinemas you were done with the game in a matter of an hour and a half if that? Oh yeah real depth there.

But we arent talking about such crap.We are talking about REAL fighting games like DOA,Tekken,Guilty Gear X,SCII,VF4;etc.Most fighting games has untapped depth to it regardless of the quality of the product.Nobody truly uses all of the best moves to most fighters.Every game including DOA3 has plenty of moves thats never used.Only gamers with true dedication to learning the ins and outs of a fighting game will discover the depth of the game.You're simply saying that DOA3 has no depth because you dont like the game Folken.The truth is that DOA3 has great depth just like any other fighting game out there.

And thats the truth.Besides what do you really know about fighters Folken? We know you can play them but remember our Tekken discussion not that long ago? You pretty much came out smelling like a Fish out of water.I pretty much owned you in the conversation.Would you like to make it two in a row here? Dont sing it compadre just bring it.

And as far as KOTOR goes? Its like this:If you love RPG's then you will love KOTOR.Bottom line.If you are a Star Wars fan then you will truly love this game even more.Its clearly the RPG of 2003 to beat right now.Nothing up and coming on the PS2 or the GC for the remainder of this year will hold a candle to this game.If you can think of one then name it it.Other than that you have no excuse to pass up trying this great game.None.Especially since you claim to love RPG's so much Folken.

slade

09-06-2003, 10:24 AM

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I know somewhat about SC2, know quite much about tekken, but I don't know enough about DOA3. I don't really care though. I only thought that because the way you described. I use parry/counter a lot in tekken and SC2. That is basically my main strategy and I add some additional variation to it.</div>

He's talking about glitches in the programming. Those maneuvers that make competing against a person nigh impossible if he utilizes the glitch effectively. I'd wager this Yoshimitsu glitch is documented somewhere.

And thats the truth.Besides what do you really know about fighters Folken? We know you can play them but remember our Tekken discussion not that long ago? You pretty much came out smelling like a Fish out of water.I pretty much owned you in the conversation.

As I remember it, you couldn't even get the definition of a charge move right. Something which the whole discussion revolved around. The whole argument was basically you telling us that Ryu's fireball motion basically amounted to a charge move. A ridiculous position btw.

Whaxx

09-06-2003, 12:09 PM

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Yeah, I know I'm not going to convince them but enough hammering and maybe the point might just get through. Whoop hasn't responded since I posted, maybe I got through.

Moody's opinion on fighters is just plain retarded. There's a reason why he lost 4 nothing to Folken.</div>

Sorry, slade, it was the first week of school, havent had much time to post. I'll admit that SC2 looks pretty fun, and I'm seriously considering picking it up. And honestly I could care less about how fighting games kept videogames alive way back when, you do know I was speaking about the current situation about fighting games? and you say I am a fool, you two wanks(Geezer, slade) should look in the mirror, eh?

slade

09-06-2003, 12:12 PM

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Sorry, slade, it was the first week of school, havent had much time to post. I'll admit that SC2 looks pretty fun, and I'm seriously considering picking it up. And honestly I could care less about how fighting games kept videogames alive way back when, you do know I was speaking about the current situation about fighting games? and you say I am a fool, you two wanks(Geezer, slade) should look in the mirroer, eh?</div>

Even if you were talking current, there's still Soul Calibur and DC. The game was to the DC launch what Halo was to the X-box launch.

Whaxx

09-06-2003, 12:17 PM

I'd say, that's pretty irrealivant because look at the state DC is in now.

slade

09-06-2003, 12:28 PM

The state of the DC, of course, had nothing to do with fighting games.

Tappy_Tibbons

09-06-2003, 12:57 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">The state of the DC, of course, had nothing to do with fighting games.</div>

and why not? DC has more fighters than PS2 or Xbox. Power Stone, SF3:DS/TS, and the superior SC1...I guess people like Slade and Folken are of a minority here.

slade

09-06-2003, 01:03 PM

Yeah, DC has the best library of fighting games out there. However, the failure of the DC had a lot to do with Sega's financial situation and nothing to do with the fact that the system had a lot of fighting games. Note, how at the end of the DC's lifespan, it had sold 12 million units worldwide. X-box and GC have only sold around 10 million units in the same timespan.

Richard Hobbes

09-06-2003, 03:41 PM

Tappy,

--- If I didn't have Xbox, I'd be getting KOTOR on PC. This
---- game in absolutely incredible. I can't complain at all
--- about it. I pity the FF series because all it has left is
--- cg... gamers shouldn't want simplistic linear video
--- story books anymore. <snip> KOTOR buries all other
--- console RPGs.

I can't agree with you here at all. While I enjoyed KOTOR, the game doesn't blow the Final Fantasy series away in any sense. Nor does KOTOR blow away many other fine console RPGs. KOTOR is a different flavor than your standard console RPG (which is refreshing), but the game has its fair share of problems. The things that mostly take away from the game are technical shortcomings such as linearity, poor graphics, poor frame rate, and bugs (animation freezing, momentary system lockups, etc.). Final Fantasy X (for example) has better graphics, a much better battle system, an equally good leveling system, and a story that is as good and in many ways more emotionally involving than KOTOR. KOTOR is an enjoyable game, but it doesn't have the character and polish that a series like Final Fantasy does. Because KOTOR was created by BioWare (the most renowned PC RPG maker), I'm surprised that the game doesn't have more polish. By comparison, I've just finished playing Neverwinter Nights (a PC RPG from BioWare) and it doesn't have any of the problems that KOTOR has. Most notably, Neverwinter Nights' graphical presentation is much better than KOTOR with detailed textures, antialiasing of 3D objects, and lighting effects that make KOTOR look extremely poor by comparison. As BioWare's first foray into the console world, KOTOR certainly shows a few growing pains but is none-the-less a very enjoyable game to play. Because of its technical issues, I would not give KOTOR the Game Of The Year award just yet.

RH.

VGV

09-07-2003, 07:33 AM

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>
He's talking about glitches in the programming. Those maneuvers that make competing against a person nigh impossible if he utilizes the glitch effectively. I'd wager this Yoshimitsu glitch is documented somewhere.
</div>

I wouldn't call any <i>near perfect</i> offense, defense, combo a glitch...delve deep enough into any 3D fighter and you'll be amazed at the <i>level of freedom</i> you'll have with any character...it's all about precision, timing and most importantly using your noggin'

P.S. If someone else pulls off moves with Yoshimitsu like I do...please let me know...I'm dying to see if they've discovered all the moves available for other characters (as I did)...

slade

09-07-2003, 08:27 AM

I wouldn't call any near perfect offense, defense, combo a glitch...

That's actually the technical term for such things as you described. There are various such things in MvC2 such as if you catch an opponent in midair with Ken's hurricane kick. The kick in this circumstance does damage equivalent to that of a super move.

Many people treat these moves as cheating and they are ofttimes banned in tournaments. I, like you, don't believe that they are cheating moves though. If it's there, it's usable.

I agree with precision and timing and using your head. Often times, in any fighter, it comes down to whether you can psyche your opponent out. I remember playing Alpha 3 with my friend and towards the last match, neither of us wanted to make the first move. We basically stood at the opening round, for a full minute, trying to lure each other into making a mistake.

VGV

09-07-2003, 02:06 PM

<div class=\"smallfont\">That's actually the technical term (note : <b>glitch</b>) for such things as you described. There are various such things in MvC2 such as if you catch an opponent in midair with Ken's hurricane kick. The kick in this circumstance does damage equivalent to that of a super move.
</div>

Thanx for the clarification on that one slade...dang...<i>move</i> has a much nicer ring to it, <i>glitch</i> somehow sounds so very politically incorrect...ah well...guess I'll have to live with it and use the technically correct term.

<div class=\"smallfont\">
Many people treat these moves as cheating and they are ofttimes banned in tournaments.
</div>

I hear ya...I'll take a true challenge any day over an easy victory (that's why my main character in <i>Soul Calibur</i> is and shall eternally remain the beautiful, slow <i>Ivy Valentine</i> wielding her most flexible sword)

<div class=\"smallfont\">
Often times, in any fighter, it comes down to whether you can psyche your opponent out.
</div>

Agreed. In my experience the most difficult matches to win are against opponents that bring <i>wisdom, intelligence</i> to the fight.

<div class=\"smallfont\">
I remember playing Alpha 3 with my friend and towards the last match, neither of us wanted to make the first move. We basically stood at the opening round, for a full minute, trying to lure each other into making a mistake.
</div>

Classic stuff there slade...the beginnings of an elegant battle of wits and skill between two <i>intelligent</i> fighters...if this is not too much to ask...I wonder...how did this one play out ?

slade

09-07-2003, 03:02 PM

Classic stuff there slade...the beginnings of an elegant battle of wits and skill between two intelligent fighters...if this is not too much to ask...I wonder...how did this one play out ?

LOL, I'm rather ashamed to say that I practically gave that first round to my friend. After one minute of waiting and goading from my brother on the sidelines, I proceeded to abandon all caution and jumped right into an uppercut. My friend had Shin Akuma and I had Ken. After the uppercut, my friend comboed went right into Akuma's ShunGokuSatsu and after that it took two or three hits on his part to finish me off.

The second round was more closely fought but I managed to win it this time when he tried the same move. This time, I did an air recovery and met his Raging Demon move with a kick in the face.

The third round, he proceeded to launch Akuma's double fireballs at me until half my health was down. Getting around those things was hard. After that he finished me off again with the same uppercut into raging demon combination. Something you can't escape from, I learned five fights later.

I tried a couple more characters but whenever I came close to beating him, he would retreat to a corner and start throwing double fireballs. After that, I just picked Shin Akuma and proceeded to use him in the same way until we both ended up agreeing on banning his usage. Towards the end, the win-loss counter was about even between us.

Excuse the geekiness but that day is number one in my top gaming moments. :D