Video Game Production Values

[no.1gamer]

I'm writing this thread to perhaps get away from the "my console is better than your console" attitude. I want to talk about aspects of gaming other than the actual graphics, gameplay, sound, innovation and exclusivity that we usually talk about.

The main reason I'm writing this thread is because when I bought Warcraft 3: The Frozen Throne I got a Blizzard notepad free in the box with the game. You could have bought the original Warcraft 3 with a DVD of all the incredible computer generated movies. Why don't more AAA games do stuff like this?

Another MAJOR complaint I have is that all games cost $50.00 when they are first released. You even pay $50 for the games that really suck when they come out. In some cases where the production value is high like in the recent 007 Everything or Nothing $50 is a fair price. However in games like Madden NFL Football 2004 I really can't justify the 50 dollar price tag. The only difference between Madden NFL Football 2004 and Madden NFL Football 2003 is the rosters of the teams which you can actually change manually anyway! Of course the 2003 season won't have the rookies that are in the 2004 game, and the schedules will obviously differ from year to year. The differences between each year is so minor that EA could actually update each season by allowing you to download the 2004 season patch. When I saw that Viewtiful Joe was only $40 when it was first released, I was quite happy. Props to Capcom for not ripping us off.

And my final complaint is the instruction manuals with games. If you buy a Nintendo fist party Gamecube exclusive game you'll get a very informative and entertaining manual that is in full color. However most multiplatform games I buy (specifically EA) come with very brief instructions printed in black and white. For the 50 bucks I'm forking over I would expect to get a better instruction manual than that. For the price of developing a quality video game I don't think printing an instruction manual in color will put that big of a dent in the budget.

I don't mean to totally single out Electronic Arts. But I really think that I should only have to pay $40 or less for next season of NBA Live. On top of that I would like to see a colorful instruction manual included with the game. I got a colorful manual with Viewtiful Joe for only $40.

Feel free to post anything that isn't directly related to the actual gaming aspect, but rather the production value of games. I'm sure that a lot of you guys agree with some of my points. Post anything that's on your mind about the production values of games we pay for.

[Bob-the-Fish]

Quite a few new games are now being released for $40. Jak II and R&C were both $40 on release. Those were both excellent games that were really worth $50. But the steal of the year was Virtua Fighter 4: Evo that was released as a greatest hit for $20. Sports fanchises need to take a hint.

[Rogue Bounty Hunter]

And my final complaint is the instruction manuals with games. If you buy a Nintendo fist party Gamecube exclusive game you'll get a very informative and entertaining manual that is in full color. However most multiplatform games I buy (specifically EA) come with very brief instructions printed in black and white. For the 50 bucks I'm forking over I would expect to get a better instruction manual than that. For the price of developing a quality video game I don't think printing an instruction manual in color will put that big of a dent in the budget.

I don't mean to totally single out Electronic Arts. But I really think that I should only have to pay $40 or less for next season of NBA Live. On top of that I would like to see a colorful instruction manual included with the game. I got a colorful manual with Viewtiful Joe for only $40.



I have a feeling that instruction books will be out by the time the next gen consoles come out. More than likely, there will be a level of training/practice for each non-sports game, kind of like the training level in the first Splinter Cell, or at the beginning of Metal Gear Solid 2.

As far as sports games, ESPN Baseball and the new All-Star Baseball games are going to be $40. It would be nice if the price came down on all the sports games, but I would still get the next NCAA Football for $50, since I know I will play it for over a year.

[E.T.]

The topic may be aimed @ consoles, but PC games have similar issues.

no 1gamer hit the nail on the head re: paying $50 for games, even the bad ones [I learned that lesson on DeusEx2]. It can be even worse for some PC games. Some are actually sold in an uplayable state!
[I find better gaming value$ by waiting for games to age a bit, prices usually fall by 30% within a year for most PC games].

Another similar aspect is the production of what should be expansions, sold as stand alone titles. These "new" games or sequels often tip their hand by including the full version of original game, with a new campaign tacked on. Yet we gamers get to pay full retail..... :mad:

And then theres that "old horse" we have beat to death: the possible trend of producing games simultaneously for PC's & consoles. Now theres a production value thats good for game developer$, lol.

[no.1gamer]

I don't understand why games go for $50 with only a few exceptions when they are released. Some games are clearly not worth the 50 bucks. Actually about PC games, I've noticed that they seem to hold their value longer than console games. I'm looking for a good deal on a great PC game that can fully utilize my new video card. But any game with killer graphics still has a $50.00 price tag on it.

My favorite way of gaming for cheap is going to Blockbuster and buying "previously rented games." It's pretty much a hit or miss as far as what selection you'll find there. But on occasion you'll find a great deal on a AAA game. And in many cases you can turn around and trade it to Gamestop for about the same price you paid for it in the first place. Of course this only works with console games...

[Brendon]

Ah, production values, something rarely heard from in the world of videogames.

But still, we shouldn't have to pay any more or less depending on the quality of a game. Let the morons who buy the crap pay full price for it. And if a game is short and sweet, rent it, seems simple enough to me. After all, we don't expect a different price for a AAA movie when we go to see it.

Heck, in my experience, you end up paying through the nose for the smaller, cultish titles. I'd hate to know which games are good and have to pay more for them.

The short movies seen in Warcraft 3 were in production for well over three to four years, and the absorbant cost of buying both renderman and huge numbers of 3Dmax plugins is well beyond the scope of anything not guarantied to be a worldwide smash, as is the case with anything ending in Craft.

But I can't help but notice nobody brought up the simple fact that throwing money at something won't nessecarily make it any good. That's why everything or nothing feels so empty when you play it, it's impossible to define the hallmarks of a development team pouring love into a project but it's unmistakeable when you sit down and play it. That's why both Windwaker and Beyond Good and Evil are so goddamn good to play, the combination of heart and the moolah to back it up is what creates the truely special games.

And for anyone who dosn't already know I think this. That's where EA go wrong, all their games have had thousands of manhours put in, the best directors and progammers to scrutinise it all, but, you just get the feeling that they were treating it as a job. Like their individual efforts wouldn't affect the product.

Then we have Efforts from smaller houses such as ICO and Guardian Heroes, games that toss aside any limitation anyone thought the medium had and toss their lot into the fire, creating a breif, but brilliant spark.

I really hope everybody dosn't treat my comments here as rambling or as a finality as I would really like to hear other people's thoughts on this.

[E.T.]

" And in many cases you can turn around and trade it to Gamestop for about the same price you paid for it in the first place. Of course this only works with console games..."

..actually, thats what I thought too. GameStop has for the last four lears [when they were formerly Babagges], & continues to give me full credit on trade in of PC games I dont like.

No question though, PC's having the ability to burn copies has killed this on a whole in the market place.

[no.1gamer]

The short movies seen in Warcraft 3 were in production for well over three to four years, and the absorbant cost of buying both renderman and huge numbers of 3Dmax plugins is well beyond the scope of anything not guarantied to be a worldwide smash, as is the case with anything ending in Craft.

I never thought of that. The fact is that the production values of super games that are guaranteed to be a "worldwide smash" will for the most part have higher production values. The video's in Warcraft 3 are above and beyond anything seen in any other video game. I would like to see something similar to those short cut scenes in a console game on my T.V. (without having to use my DVD player).

So if the game is pretty much a guaranteed "worlwide smash" the production value will be higher. That's why Nintendo and Blizzard games are always the cream of the crop.

And by the way I actually think the new 007 Everything or Nothing is pretty sweet. I don't know why everyone here is trashing it. It's getting solid review scores across the board.

[Rogue Bounty Hunter]

My favorite way of gaming for cheap is going to Blockbuster and buying "previously rented games." It's pretty much a hit or miss as far as what selection you'll find there. But on occasion you'll find a great deal on a AAA game. And in many cases you can turn around and trade it to Gamestop for about the same price you paid for it in the first place. Of course this only works with console games...


Sometimes I do the opposite. If I ever get a hold of a cheap game from EBGames, Circuit City, Gamestop, etc, and I end up not liking it, I can usually take it to Blockbuster's GameRush and trade it and make a profit. For instance, I took Kya (paid $10) to BB and received $21 credit. Rogue Ops was another one, I paid $15 for it and received $25 credit for it.

The only thing I have against getting a "previously rented title" is the fact that I always end up with a generic BB dvd case for the game, instead of the green one for Xbox or the ones made to secure the small GC games.