Which system has the wimpiest, easiest games?

[Gadfly2317]

A Nintendo executive recently commented on the need to make games easier, to appeal to a wider range of gamers. Supposedly games have gotten too hard for the average gamer. Wah wah, boo hoo.

X-box fans have recently bashed PS2 fans on this board for playing easy games that are little more than CGI-fests. And X-box fans in general tend to feel their system is the most challenging difficulty level for the adult, hardcore, or long time gamer.

But despite Nintendo's statement about the need to make easy games, it looks to me like the very hardest, most insanely challenging games out there are on this system. Games that appeal to gamers who grew up playing HARD games, not wimpy endless ammo/save anywhere FPS/storytelling games.

Ikaruga: Play this you PS2 and Xbox wimps. This is one of the hardest games ever.
Super Monkey Ball: Laugh at the giggley diaper wearing monkeys all you want. I dare you Final Fantasy marshmallows to get through some of the the insanely challenging levels on this stage.
Even Super Mario Sunshine was criticized in Japan for its high difficulty level.

And now today: F-Zero. Check out what IGN had to say:

"But -- let's get this out of the way now and not dwell on it -- inexperienced players who, say, haven't grown up playing games of this type and are unfamiliar with their workings, might never fully adapt and conquer some of the challenges in place. We honestly believe that some people just won't get it regardless of how much they practice. Players will either have the skills or they won't."

Looks to me like not only does GC offer some of the most fun and innovative games, but that this is the console that's home to the most challenging hardcore games out there too.

If your PS2 or Xbox has something more challenging than these games, step up and brag.

[Fragmastar]

I don't think there really is an answer to your question. All systems make supreme difficult games and sometimes they make easy, or what you call "wimpy" games. The good news is that all systems release more challenging games than wimpy games.

But I still strongly believe that PS2 is the best system in the world! :P

Xbox and GC fans must have thought that I showed a bit of respect for the two anti-sony *cough* console systems *cough*

[E.T.]

Excuse the interuption from a PC gamer [Im here for motivation to purchase a console], but do not the console formatted games have adjustable difficulty sliders?

I know that most of the 60+ pc games I have are extremely hard to beat if set to max difficulty. [try Vietcong on "Vietnam"/hardest setting, no saves, no health pick ups].

BTW, does the System Wars board encompass PC gaming systems also, or is it actually a "Console Wars" board?

"School me"......

[folken001]

<div class=\"smallfont\">A Nintendo executive recently commented on the need to make games easier, to appeal to a wider range of gamers. Supposedly games have gotten too hard for the average gamer. Wah wah, boo hoo.

X-box fans have recently bashed PS2 fans on this board for playing easy games that are little more than CGI-fests. And X-box fans in general tend to feel their system is the most challenging difficulty level for the adult, hardcore, or long time gamer.

But despite Nintendo's statement about the need to make easy games, it looks to me like the very hardest, most insanely challenging games out there are on this system. Games that appeal to gamers who grew up playing HARD games, not wimpy endless ammo/save anywhere FPS/storytelling games.

Ikaruga: Play this you PS2 and Xbox wimps. This is one of the hardest games ever.
Super Monkey Ball: Laugh at the giggley diaper wearing monkeys all you want. I dare you Final Fantasy marshmallows to get through some of the the insanely challenging levels on this stage.
Even Super Mario Sunshine was criticized in Japan for its high difficulty level.

And now today: F-Zero. Check out what IGN had to say:

"But -- let's get this out of the way now and not dwell on it -- inexperienced players who, say, haven't grown up playing games of this type and are unfamiliar with their workings, might never fully adapt and conquer some of the challenges in place. We honestly believe that some people just won't get it regardless of how much they practice. Players will either have the skills or they won't."

Looks to me like not only does GC offer some of the most fun and innovative games, but that this is the console that's home to the most challenging hardcore games out there too.

If your PS2 or Xbox has something more challenging than these games, step up and brag.</div>

Dodonpachi Dai Ou Jou on PS2 is the hardest game I have ever encountered. I have also played Ikaruga on DC and it is not an easy game. However you have shield to protect yourself in that game. In Dopodpachi, u have nothing but to dodge them. I dont see how anyone could beat the last boss on hard without dying like 100 times. Anyways, one Japanese guy did beat it without dying once with normal difficulty setting.

[stevedperkins]

BTW, does the System Wars board encompass PC gaming systems also, or is it actually a "Console Wars" board?Well, up until last week the board was on a site devoted exclusively to consoles... so historically I guess you could say that's accurate. However, since that site has merged with a PC gaming board, I really don't see any reason why PC's wouldn't be on-topic. It's only been up a couple of days, and I've already been in a couple of PC threads. The only thing is that I really don't see PC's and consoles as "competitors" in any kind of "war"... they're both good for different types of games. There really isn't any strategy games on the level of Civilization or Warcraft for consoles, and the closest thing to a Mario-style adventure game on PC was that "Jazz Jackrabbit" shareware title several years back. The two worlds really don't compete much head-to-head.

[slade]

<div class=\"smallfont\">A Nintendo executive recently commented on the need to make games easier, to appeal to a wider range of gamers. Supposedly games have gotten too hard for the average gamer. Wah wah, boo hoo.</div>

John Carmack agreed with Nintendo:
http://money.cnn.com/2003/08/21/commentary/game_over/column_gaming/index.htm

Put this way, it makes some sense. They want games to be easily accessible to everybody and I agree that it should be so but I also don't want the challenge to suffer because of it. What companies should concentrate on is to provide both accessability and challenge. I think a good example of this is the player progress indicator in Devil May Cry. The game actually follows the progress of the player and if he isn't doing so well, it actually tells him that a lower difficulty level may be more suitable.

Incidentally, if you want an example of a really hard mainstream PS2 title, this is it.

[T.Tashi]

Warren Spector (Deus Ex) basically said the same thing. I don't think simple necessarily means easy, but no doubt, console games are more simplistic than the PC, generally speaking. You are compressing several dozen keys into a 16 button controller in some instances. Some consider it dumbing down, and maybe it is, but they have a point with making games more accessible to the general newbie gaming public. I like a challenge but a lot of my friends don't want that. They just want to play and have fun doing it with without some frustrating gameplay mechanic getting in the way. DDR works great for that I think, and so do a lot of other games. But still its not like the old days before the net and guides where if you were stuck in a game you just were. Or you called some 900 number for hints. The internet and cheat codes allow many to bypass the difficulty of a lot of games. Which is ok I think.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

Gadfly, I suggest you try Halo on legendary difficulty before you come in here talking about how "easy" FPS games are. I suppose you are under that impression because of how simplistic Metroid Prime is. Sorry, but one old school shooter and one great party game do not a console make for challenging games. I'm not whining about challenge, If I were you, I'd be whining about how every 1st party Nintendo action game features auto lock on technology therefore making kids like you lazier and lazier...oh well, just more meat for the frying pan known as me as I roast you lazy punks. I don't use auto aim, only the unskilled ones do.

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\">Gadfly, I suggest you try Halo on legendary difficulty before you come in here talking about how "easy" FPS games are. I suppose you are under that impression because of how simplistic Metroid Prime is. Sorry, but one old school shooter and one great party game do not a console make for challenging games. I'm not whining about challenge, If I were you, I'd be whining about how every 1st party Nintendo action game features auto lock on technology therefore making kids like you lazier and lazier...oh well, just more meat for the frying pan known as me as I roast you lazy punks. I don't use auto aim, only the unskilled ones do.</div>

You don't use auto-aim? Judging from that stupid ancient picture you put in every post I figured you just ran over people in RTCW rather than shoot them.

Why are you comparing what you call "action" games with auto-lock to "FPS?" True FPS on GC don't feature auto lock. And anyway, don't you play all your FPS on a PC where they belong?

[Glockstar]

<div class=\"smallfont\">"A Nintendo executive recently commented on the need to make games easier, to appeal to a wider range of gamers. Supposedly games have gotten too hard for the average gamer. Wah wah, boo hoo."

"... this [the GC] is the console that's home to the most challenging hardcore games out there too."

"If your PS2 or Xbox has something more challenging than these games, step up and brag."</div>

Oh you've done it now. You got me all riled up!

1) Gunvalkrie... a real Biiiiiiiiitch!
2) Serious Sam... on Serious (Serious as a heart attack! Fahgetaboutit!)
3) Halo... on Legendary
4) MotoGP2... some of the challenges are nothing but a sick, twisted, effin joke! And in case you didn't hear me right, they're NOT FUN! And you could say the exact same thing about this games hardest sp level, Legend, as you could about F-Zero... 'You either have the skills or you don't.' I don't. :~(
5) Project Gotham Racing... hello wall
6) Buffy... on any level other than easy
7) DOA-XBV... and it's not just the volleyball that's hard
8) Blinx... or is it just me?
9) Wolfenstein... on XBL vs Tappy (or so I hear) :p

Ikaruga will soon be within my grasp, heh heh hehhh. So check back with me in a couple of weeks and I'll tell where you I think this game stands.

[stevedperkins]

7) DOA-XBV... and it's not just the volleyball that's hardReally? <b><i>Really?!?</i></b> Can someone <i>please</i> tell me if the DOA Volleyball marketing is for real... or if it's it's all a big inside joke, and people really buy it because volleyball games are actually a lot more fun than they sound.

Check this out: http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/sports/deadoralivextremebv/screens_2909414.html?page=12

People actually get <b><i>sexually aroused</i></b> over <b><i>CARTOON CHARACTERS</i></b>, then refer to <i>Nintendo</i> as a "kiddie system"?!? Are you kidding me?!? I mean, <b><i>look</i></b> at that screenshot and explain the popularity of this genre of games (semi-or-fully-nude chicks playing volleyball or riding BMX bikes) to me. There are hundreds of millions of photographs available online of Jenna Jameson and Asia Carrera, and people are paying fifty bucks to get sexual arousal from cartoons in a video game. I honestly don't feel like <i>mocking</i> it... I just feel overwhelmed with pity and want to <i>understand</i> it.

[Glockstar]

<div class=\"smallfont\">Really? <b><i>Really?!?</i></b> Can someone <i>please</i> tell me if the DOA Volleyball marketing is for real... or if it's it's all a big inside joke, and people really buy it because volleyball games are actually a lot more fun than they sound.

Check this out: http://www.gamespot.com/xbox/sports/deadoralivextremebv/screens_2909414.html?page=12

People actually get <b><i>sexually aroused</i></b> over <b><i>CARTOON CHARACTERS</i></b>, then refer to <i>Nintendo</i> as a "kiddie system"?!? Are you kidding me?!? I mean, <b><i>look</i></b> at that screenshot and explain the popularity of this genre of games (semi-or-fully-nude chicks playing volleyball or riding BMX bikes) to me. There are hundreds of millions of photographs available online of Jenna Jameson and Asia Carrera, and people are paying fifty bucks to get sexual arousal from cartoons in a video game. I honestly don't feel like <i>mocking</i> it... I just feel overwhelmed with pity and want to <i>understand</i> it.</div>

ROLMAO!
I wasn't refferring to "sexual arousal", you numbnut! LOL! (Although... looking at it now... I can see how you'd think that. :p )

What I was refferring to was the fact that you have to maintain positive relationships with the other women on the island, if you want them to play volleyball with you. That not only means winning the games, when they're your partner, but also pampering them with gawd-knows-what. And because they're women - it ain't easy!!! It's tough even just trying to figure them out!

It's funny though, because you're the one that sounds frustrated here.

[trebor]

<div class=\"smallfont\">Gadfly, I suggest you try Halo on legendary difficulty before you come in here talking about how &quot;easy&quot; FPS games are. I suppose you are under that impression because of how simplistic Metroid Prime is. Sorry, but one old school shooter and one great party game do not a console make for challenging games. I'm not whining about challenge, If I were you, I'd be whining about how every 1st party Nintendo action game features auto lock on technology therefore making kids like you lazier and lazier...oh well, just more meat for the frying pan known as me as I roast you lazy punks. I don't use auto aim, only the unskilled ones do.</div>

How blissful is your ignorance there, Tappy? First off, and I can't stress this enough, Metroid Prime is not a First Person Shooter. Yes it's in first person perspective, but that doesn't automatically make it a FPS.

Example: when you use your bow and arrow in Ocarina of Time it is in first person perspective, so does that make Zelda:OoT a FPS? No.

Anyways, try beating Metroid Prime on Hard mode and get back to me about how "easy" it is - even with the "lazy" auto-targeting. Which, if I had a futuristic set of alien power armor, I would expect to have some kind of targeting system.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

How blissful is your ignorance there, Tappy? First off, and I can't stress this enough, Metroid Prime is not a First Person Shooter. Yes it's in first person perspective, but that doesn't automatically make it a FPS.

Example: when you use your bow and arrow in Ocarina of Time it is in first person perspective, so does that make Zelda:OoT a FPS? No.

Anyways, try beating Metroid Prime on Hard mode and get back to me about how "easy" it is - even with the "lazy" auto-targeting. Which, if I had a futuristic set of alien power armor, I would expect to have some kind of targeting system.</div>


sorry, but single player games with respawning enemies complete with lock on aim where I cant even aim myself because Nintendo was too lazy to make a decent look up/down system is not my idea of a good time.

[shogun]

damn...

You call Metroid Prime "easy", yet you can't even figure out how to manually aim. News flash for you, it's not that hard...the game doesn't automatically auto-target, so if you want to pretend you're playing a fps(as master chief perhaps?) just don't press "R."

Anyways, someone who doesn't take the time to play a game on its hardest setting, also shouldn't take the time to ***** about how easy it is.... :o

[trebor]

<div class=\"smallfont\">&lt;div class=\&quot;smallfont\&quot;&gt;&lt;/div&gt;


sorry, but single player games with respawning enemies complete with lock on aim where I cant even aim myself because Nintendo was too lazy to make a decent look up/down system is not my idea of a good time.</div>

Gee, Tappy, I seem to recall you stating that you "hate" single-player games and that only online games are worthy of your attention. So why would I care what you think about MP, when you wouldn't give it a chance in the first place. Have you actually ever played it?

Don't destroy your credibility to "The Game's" level and start bashing games you've never actually played.

["The Game"Evolution]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

Dodonpachi Dai Ou Jou on PS2 is the hardest game I have ever encountered. I have also played Ikaruga on DC and it is not an easy game. However you have shield to protect yourself in that game. In Dopodpachi, u have nothing but to dodge them. I dont see how anyone could beat the last boss on hard without dying like 100 times. Anyways, one Japanese guy did beat it without dying once with normal difficulty setting.</div>

On the Xbox I can honestly say that Panzer Dragoon Orta,Splinter Cell,and Indiana Jones was the hardest games I 've played thusfar.

KOTOR was challenging though.But not too hard to figure out solutions.For the PS2 I would have to say that GTA:Vice City was pretty hard in the beginning.The first Devil May Cry had its difficult moments too.Other than that I havent been totally stomped by anything else.Plus I still feel that Splinter Cell is ten times harder and more challenging than MGS2 was.

btw,whats up Folken.I'm back!!! And yes I still cant wait till you get some time for a possible rematch on Live.Just try not to do a "Lennex Lewis" okay? LOL!

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>


9) Wolfenstein... on XBL vs Tappy (or so I hear) :p

Ikaruga will soon be within my grasp, heh heh hehhh. So check back with me in a couple of weeks and I'll tell where you I think this game stands.</div>


Yeah, Tappy apparently has some sort of vehicle he runs over you with in RTCW. Sounds like cheating to me.

When you get Ikaruga, I'd love to hear what you think of it. I kind of fizzled out. . . I never have beaten the 5th level. But, I still pop the game in; maybe someday I'll actually put in the concentrated time necessary to beat it.

[Whaxx]

Heh, you guys are forgetting a little game called Tetris, that game was so hard for me, and BTW just because games are long, doesn't make them hard.