Should I get a new PC?

[atmosphere]

I personally have some questions about buying a new machine.
I bought a computer from Ibuypower.com almost 3 years ago:
AMD Tbird 1 GHZ
256 SD PC 133 RAM
Asus A7V KT-133 Motherboard
Elsa Gladiac Geforce2 GTS 32 MB DDR RAM (bought this seperate from system on buy.com)
20 GB HD
----------------
Obvoisly this system will not be fit to run Doom 3 or HL 2, so where do you guys suggest I get a system? Is building one an option? When could I get the parts? What are you recommendations.

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\">I personally have some questions about buying a new machine.
I bought a computer from Ibuypower.com almost 3 years ago:
AMD Tbird 1 GHZ
256 SD PC 133 RAM
Asus A7V KT-133 Motherboard
Elsa Gladiac Geforce2 GTS 32 MB DDR RAM (bought this seperate from system on buy.com)
20 GB HD
----------------
Obvoisly this system will not be fit to run Doom 3 or HL 2, so where do you guys suggest I get a system? Is building one an option? When could I get the parts? What are you recommendations.</div>

Build one... It's cheaper, and you're guaranteed to have in your machine compatible components. Any computer hardware store can sell and order what you're looking for, or you can order it from the net. I have an Asus/Via Mobo, with an AMD CPU, with DDR RAM, and a Soundblaster card... runs great and is virtually crash free. It's upgradable, and was dirt cheap. Building your own is the only way to go, unless you want to order a specific gaming machine from Alienware, or VooDoo etc... but you'll be paying through the nose for a machine like that.

[atmosphere]

SBS, what do you mean by that they are "gaming" machines? Are they better for gaming or are they really just overrated?
BTW, What about this "priceline.com".
Anyone have any experience with this?

[moya]

He means that Alienware, Falcon NW, VoodooPC etc. specifically target gamers. They build their PCs to a higher spec than, say, Dell or someone like that. They claim to use only the best components for gaming PCs. Their PCs are good (or so I've heard), but they're also very expensive and it's not as if they're using any "magic" ingredients or anything. Besides the special custom cases you can get the guts of one of their PCs from any old hardware site usually for much cheaper.

If you do decide to build though, be sure to do your homework before you start. There are plenty of good "Build your own PC" guides out there, and read up on the best components to buy for your machine (this means trawling through tech sites reading reviews). You'll want a decent motherboard (those based on the N-force 2 chipset are fairly good, e.g. A-bit, ASUS, Gigabyte if you're going AMD), a good case and power supply unit (ideally over 400W), and, possibly most importantly, a good graphics card. The Geforce4Ti range (note: avoid anything with MX) are pretty solid cards for their price. However, depending on whether you want to upgrade sooner rather than later, you may want to go for the higher end of the market: the ATi Radeon 9800Pro 128MB or the GeforceFX5900 are pretty much the top of the range right now (with a top of the range price). Note: they're probably overkill for most of today's games, but once the next-gen DX9 titles start appearing you'll notice a difference.

By the way, let us know how you get on.

[Static_Fred]

If you want to build your own system, find your parts at www.pricewatch.com. Pretty cheat stuff here. Personally, i was intimidated about building my "whole" computer from scratch, so i waited for a good sale for about 2 months, and then i picked up a Compaq athlon 2000xp with 512 ram for $450. I have been slowly adding the optional components for the 8 months, and am very happy with it.
You should be able to find a way better deal than this now if you choose to buy a pre-built computer.

[atmosphere]

I will be able to buy this PC about one year from now.
I am almost 15 years old and know a good amount about computers but priceline.com makes me a bit suspicious. How good are these parts? And what about all these strange brands....
Also, I am curious where I should get the specs for my computer...
Probably PC GAMER, because in their magazine they put down all of the parts, which will make me confident that they are high qaulity and compatible with one another.

[Renzatic Gear]

I will be able to buy this PC about one year from now.
I am almost 15 years old and know a good amount about computers but priceline.com makes me a bit suspicious. How good are these parts? And what about all these strange brands....
Also, I am curious where I should get the specs for my computer...
Probably PC GAMER, because in their magazine they put down all of the parts, which will make me confident that they are high qaulity and compatible with one another.

I wouldn't worry about pricewatch.com, I get my stuff there all the time and I have yet to be let down. Basically all you're doing there is ordering your hardware directly from a warehouse instead of going through a middleman, that's how you're able to get the parts so inexpensively. The quality of their hardware isn't something you'll need to worry about either, just make sure you look at what you're getting because they offer everything from cheap, generic manufacturers all the way up to the brand name stuff.

You can also hit up Newegg.com, they have the best customer satisfaction policy I've ever seen. Don't like something you got and want something else for the same price? Give em a call and they'll send you what you want free of charge with a ton of stickers and a t-shirt.

[atmosphere]

I just noticed that I kept calling pricewatch, "priceline" ; hope that doesn't cause confusion. The problem is that on priceline there are so many motherboards and so many different types of motherboards and how do you know what is the "standard, good" thing that will be compatable. I mean I do know of some good motherboard brands (Asus and MSI) but what about all of those different models. How do you know which one model is good for you? Seeing an ASUS motherboard priced at 90 dollars has me a bit suspicious, thinking the board model might not be as good as a "standard" model.

[Renzatic Gear]

I just noticed that I kept calling pricewatch, "priceline" ; hope that doesn't cause confusion. The problem is that on priceline there are so many motherboards and so many different types of motherboards and how do you know what is the "standard, good" thing that will be compatable. I mean I do know of some good motherboard brands (Asus and MSI) but what about all of those different models. How do you know which one model is good for you? Seeing an ASUS motherboard priced at 90 dollars has me a bit suspicious, thinking the board model might not be as good as a "standard" model.
If you're gonna attempt to build your own comp instead of getting a preassembled one then it'd be a good idea to do a bit of reading up beforehand to see what's best for how much you wanna spend. Toms Hardware (http://www.tomshardware.com) and Guru3D (http://www.guru3d.com) are 2 sites I hit up when I'm looking for info.

As for motherboards, if you're looking for a good Athlon platform you have 2 good choices: any board based on the VIA KT333 and above chipset or the nVidia Nforce2 boards. The Nforce2 is the best bet if you want the most performance, but the KT333 boards are a bit less expensive and still a good, solid performer. Motherboards in general aren't all that expensive anyway, you can expect to pay around $60-80 for a good one and about $150 for the latest and greatest.

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\">How do you know which one model is good for you? Seeing an ASUS motherboard priced at 90 dollars has me a bit suspicious, thinking the board model might not be as good as a "standard" model.</div>

Yup, RG has it right- time to do your homework...

[Aku]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>Building your own is the only way to go, unless you want to order a specific gaming machine from Alienware, or VooDoo etc... but you'll be paying through the nose for a machine like that.</div>

No, there is a third choice to building vs. buying an overpriced 'gaming' pc. If you know what you want, you can get a good machine for less than a king's ransom. I payed $1200 for mine, and that was after tax and shipping. I see these systems that go for $2500 and up and I think that's ridiculous. Of course, if you're comfortable building your own machine, then go ahead and build it.

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

No, there is a third choice to building vs. buying an overpriced 'gaming' pc. If you know what you want, you can get a good machine for less than a king's ransom. I payed $1200 for mine, and that was after tax and shipping. I see these systems that go for $2500 and up and I think that's ridiculous. Of course, if you're comfortable building your own machine, then go ahead and build it.</div>

That still doesn't compete with building your own... nothing comes cheaper than that. I bet you I could have built yours for 200 less, including my fees...

[DBS]

The gaming computers usually have added fans, video cooling, and most are overclocked some and burned in tested to check stability. Cool cases, neon lights etc and even expensive custom paintjobs. And yes it is over the top and aimed at the pc game snob with cash to burn but I still look and drool at times wishing I could have the cash to try one.
There are great deals all over the net and Dell has been good to me for the last few years. I have also had good luck with HP before Dell and the next system I am ready to put together myself.
The advantage to your own is you know the hardware you are getting, nothing oem (which is sometimes stripped of extra features) and can save cash. The bad if you run into trouble you have no support other than us here:) Although most support is fairly poor still I know some people who call to learn how to delete shortcuts, move taskbar off the top..etc
I would say personally I would not go under a 2 gig processor now to have enough power for a few years, 512 or more ddr memory, if you go Nforce 2 they actually have good built in sound on the motherboard which if you are unhappy with later you can always add a sound card of your choice and go as high up on the graphics card as you can without going for broke. Get a 7200,8 meg cache (80-120 gig) hard drive for ample room for your games and a cdrw or dvdrw is nice to own to backup data, gamesaves, pictures etc.

AMD will save you some cash as Intel is still pricey and either is a fine processor.

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\">Cool cases, neon lights etc and even expensive custom paintjobs.</div>

A lot of the "paint-jobs" are actually stickers and "skins".

[atmosphere]

I am confused about this OEM. I keep hearing this term everywhere and still do not know what it is.... So dell,HP,alienware,falcon,etc. all use OEM and OEM is bad?

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\">I am confused about this OEM. I keep hearing this term everywhere and still do not know what it is.... So dell,HP,alienware,falcon,etc. all use OEM and OEM is bad?</div>
Original Equipment Manufacturer. Bad? I dunno about that, you get the odd image thrown into the software and graphic user interfaces (like Dell logo's on the Control Panel), which can be removed with a little know-how, but the largest sticking point that I have had with OEM machines, is the warranty (and hardware configurations)... In no way should you EVER open up a box if it's OEM... you'll void the warranty faster than a Pitbull on a Poodle, and this sucks for us gamers... since we need to get into them often.

[Aku]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

That still doesn't compete with building your own... nothing comes cheaper than that. I bet you I could have built yours for 200 less, including my fees...</div>

Yeah, but the shipping from Canada would have wiped out the diference. ;)

I don't mind paying the extra couple hundred, because it buys me someone to yell at it if the thing doesn't work, or if something breaks within the warranty period. A lot better than yelling at yourself. :)

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

Yeah, but the shipping from Canada would have wiped out the diference. ;)

I don't mind paying the extra couple hundred, because it buys me someone to yell at it if the thing doesn't work, or if something breaks within the warranty period. A lot better than yelling at yourself. :)</div>

Funny thing though, when they're built by yourself... they hardly ever seem to break. Hmmm?

[DBS]

For instance companies like Dell and HP etc do such a volume of buisness hardware manufacturers make some just for them. OEM Nvidia cards for Dell for example or Dell printers made by HP etc. Sometimes you see OEM hardware for sale on ebay or priceline and usually they are fine just don't have the bundle that the retail version would get. You buy a video card from Compusa etc you get the card, drivers, games (usually) and maybe windvd. You buy a cheaper oem card that is a generic no name Nvidia 64 meg card for example you get the card. Sometimes the hardware alone and no driver but they are available online.

Anyhow..not trying to make a huge issue out of something that isn't. One thing you can also do is get a computer missing or with the cheapest component and upgrade it to a retail when you get it. For instance buying one without a modem or maybe the lowest video card as you own a decent one to stick in it on arrival.
The only thing you are stuck with Dell, HP, Compac, etc is you can not change the processor or motherboards. Doing so will void the warrenty and they make it hard as they use hardware built for them. (OEM motherboards)
Voodoo,Falcon Northwest, Alienware,ABS you pay more but they are totally upgradable so you get more life out of them. And as SBS said the best way to get the longest life is to know enough about the hardware to build one yourself. The comment that they hardly ever have problems though is maybe his luck. I do know someone who always builds his own and has more trouble with his systems than I would have patience for. But as a side note...he tends to punch his machine now and again as well :)

[Aku]

<div class=\"smallfont\">I do know someone who always builds his own and has more trouble with his systems than I would have patience for. But as a side note...he tends to punch his machine now and again as well :)</div>

Yeah, punching your computer - that'll put a good scare into it to stop crashing....or else. ;)

[Suicides-by-Steve]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

Yeah, punching your computer - that'll put a good scare into it to stop crashing....or else. ;)</div>

LOL *shakes head*

[E.T.]

Unless I missed it early on in thread, one very beneficial element of building your own system is the knowledge gained [If mentioned, my apologies]. Atmosphere, you didnt mention how your mechanical, or dexterity skills are. Soldering on your mother board for *EXAMPLE ONLY, will take a steady hand & some experience. Its easy to trash hardware of any kind, I've seen "the uncoordinated" cross thread attachment screws for their video card as well as not being able to sense torque.

I've headed down this road of indecision three times now. Each time I end up buying a custom built unit [one Dell, two Gateways]. The reason isnt the assembling of hardware components, thats easy for me. Its due to my lack of software knowledge. A few months back I purchased my third PC. I priced the components [as close as possible to what I'd be getting custom built] & realized about a $200 savings. If I understood the OS better & the freaked out moment of the first boot, I would have built my own. The $200 savings is & was secondary to my decision. Service is another facet that influenced my decision [I'll get flamed for this one, lol!]. I like the fact I can pick up the phone [on my Gold Plan] & get in home response in 24hr or less. This will last four years on my new system & covers parts/labor. Toll free tech support included. The costs was extra $129. My experience has been stellar w/tech service & phone response time, others havnt :( BTW, all my sytems are still running & have been reliable. I do admit to having game performance issues, again cause Im a self learner on PC tech & caused most of them... & that can really slow things down! I do admit regret to some degree, not having built my own [I love to construct]. Like DBS said, you can do some beautiful custom paint work & cosmetics you wont be able to buy elsewhere. [Then you can take it to the International Portland Roadster Show :D ].

I tend to agree with AKU on what a good value is regarding a PC purchase at the moment. You can get alot of system [2.6mhz] for $1200 to $1500. These sytems would easily have been $3000 a couple short years ago. Also, Windows XP has really stabalized the gaming world for me [few, if any freezes/crashes w/system restore option to help resolve problems].

In short, build yours if you are software savy & can handle a screw driver in close quarters. The experience will put you leeps ahead in understanding pc guts. If you want it fast & you want it now buy a Gateway or Dell, just spec the good hardware.

[atmosphere]

Well, I had some problems with my 1 ghz athlon PC that I ordered from IBUYPOWER.com so I called tech support 3 weeks ago. The headphone port on my soundcard(sb live) died so they said they would ship a new one out (sb live 5.1, unlike the regular non 5.1 one I had). I called today to find out they havn't shipped it and the guy says he apoligizes and tells me that it will arrive tommorow. Next I talk to some other guy and tell him about my parrell port problem and he says they will send me a new motherboard as well. Then he tells me that the parts will arrive in 5-7 business days (so I guess my soundcard will be delayed AGAIN!!).
Some of the people I spoke to were OK but others just wanted to piss me off. Hopefully they will send me a decent motherboard because they said that my ASUS KT133 is outdated.
Another thing :
What about fans for the PC? How do you know how many to put? Where to put them?

[Renzatic Gear]

Computer fans. If you don't plan on doing any major overclocking you can get away with just having a fan on your heatsink and thats it, but most basic ATX cases come with at least one mount in the front and one in the back. If you were to go with a high end case, though, you could have as many as 2 mounts in the front, 2 in the back, 2 on top of the case and 2 on the side..thats kind of overkill for what you're probably gonna want and a good bit more expensive.

[atmosphere]

What about 4x agp and 8x? I have 4x agp on my ASUS KT133 and I am curious as to see if the new motherboard they will send me will have 8x AGP.

[Renzatic Gear]

What about 4x agp and 8x? I have 4x agp on my ASUS KT133 and I am curious as to see if the new motherboard they will send me will have 8x AGP.
I doubt it. The KT133 is an old, old chipset and I don't think they have AGP 8x on any boards older than the KT333 or 400. When you get your replacement in it'll probably be the exact same board you've already got..it'd be nice if they sent you a better one but I don't think anyone does that, unfortunately.

Course you might luck out with an order mixup. That happened to a friend of mine, Newegg sent him 2 of everything he ordered didn't charge him for the extra crap..he got 2 comps for the price of 1.

[moya]

Woah, that's one lucky friend! Wish I had his luck... :)

[atmosphere]

Hmmm, well the tech support actually DID say that they will not send me the KT133 because its outdated. Tech support did mention that they will send me something that is compatible with my AMD Tbird 1 ghz CPU.

[atmosphere]

I've calcullated the difference between going new egg and ibuypower.com (they build custom pcs) and its only 100 dollars...
Hmmm..

[moya]

Yeah, I got around a £100-150 difference between buying components and self-building and buying a custom-built one. I went for the custom-build option. It's up to you, but there are plenty of guides around for free. If you have the time to learn and inclination, you should be okay.

[atmosphere]

So just in case I go custom, where do you guys recommend I buy. I bought my previous computer at ibuypower.com, and it seems like these guys still have the best prices.

[moya]

I bought mine from a UK custom-build company, so that's not going to be much use to you I'm afraid...

[Renzatic Gear]

You can also try cyberpowerpc.com, they always seem to have pretty good deals on prebuilt comps.

[E.T.]

<div class=\"smallfont\">So just in case I go custom, where do you guys recommend I buy. I bought my previous computer at ibuypower.com, and it seems like these guys still have the best prices.</div>


http://www.gateway.com/index.shtml

Gateway & Dell compete well w/smaller firms.
Gateway has desktops starting @ $399.
Gateway has P4 systems starting @ $499.

I shopped my new system around: smaller, local shops could beat price by as much as $200, but the waranty was 90 days compared to Gateways 4 yr parts/labor, Liftime toll free tech support. Also, I received more software [video/photo edit] than from smaller guys.

Shop smart & compare apples w/apples!

[Renzatic Gear]

If you go with Dell or Gateway make sure that all the hardware is brandname stuff. The reason I usually avoid the big comp companies is because they use cheap components to cut corners and cost on their end.

[ceevee]

<div class=\"smallfont\"><div class=\"smallfont\"></div>

Shop smart & compare apples w/apples!</div>

an excellent piece of advice! its easy to get perplexed by meandering buses and digital clocks

[Aku]

The pc I just bought from Gentech has all name-brand parts (Asus, Toshiba, Mitsumi, Creative, etc.). Their computers are very competitively priced. But with them, you just get parts, no labor. So when my power supply blew out, they sent me a new one, and I put it in. If you don't mind doing stuff yourself, then that isn't a bad deal. Also, with their phone support, it's mom-and-pop style. You call up the sales number, give your account number, and usually the guy who answers the phone to take the orders is also one of the tech guys. So, there's no waiting on hold and you get immediate service. The downside is that it ain't no 24/7 - business hours M-F only, and they will come to work late. As for the faulty power supply, I originally blamed Gentech for a bad part, but I have since learned that I was overloading the outlet the computer was hooked up to, which probably had something to do with it. I just had an electrician out to hook a dedicated line to that outlet today, so that should solve the problem.

[ceevee]

just like moya, i'm based in the uk. but i've just done a quick search for you to.. well.. compare apples with apples, but i'm running the risk of meandering buses and digital clocks so you'll need to excuse my lacklustre foibles

<a href="http://www.anandtech.com/guides/index.html">anandtech </a>

<a href="http://www.sharkyextreme.com/guides/index.php">sharkyextreme</a>

hope they are of some help

[E.T.]

<div class=\"smallfont\">If you go with Dell or Gateway make sure that all the hardware is brandname stuff. The reason I usually avoid the big comp companies is because they use cheap components to cut corners and cost on their end.</div>

Rg's right about that to some degree. While I spec the good stuff when ordering, some hardware choices are limited. One area both Dell & Gateway suffer [IMO] is there marginal PSU's. My old system [P3 500mhz] worked fine w/factory installe VooDoo 3000. A year latter I upgrade to G2 64mb, so far, so good. The following year I attempted to install a G4 128 mb ti card. Had warm boot problems/ a few disaply glitches. Come to find out nVidia suggests a PSU rating of 300 watt minimum...turns out my old system had a 150 watt PSU!
When I ordered my new system about five months ago, I found that options hadnt improved that much [PSU's increased to whopping 250watt max! lol]. While I never had many problems with either of my two Gateway or one Dell systems as sold to me, Id do wish they would offer more hardware options overall.

In the end, I like service, and am not inclined to be concerned about beakdowns or longevity. Gateway & Dell have some of the best warranties in buisness, but you do pay extra for the extended/premium services.

[atmosphere]

I've heard many people say to avoid dell,gateway,compaq,hp, and all those big companies because they use custom motherboards,etc.
From what I see cyberpower and ibuypower are exactly the same company.... hmmm
I am still tearing between buying ibuypower and building.

[E.T.]

<div class=\"smallfont\">I've heard many people say to avoid dell,gateway,compaq,hp, and all those big companies because they use custom motherboards,etc.
From what I see cyberpower and ibuypower are exactly the same company.... hmmm
I am still tearing between buying ibuypower and building.</div>

Not sure what you mean buy "custom mother boards"...but, I can say my Gateway MB's are NOT proprietary [they can be replaced], sadly however, my Dell [two year old P3700] is proprieatry [soldered in harness]. I learned that after the sale, lol.

No doubt, custom building gives you a lot more options on hardware.