The problems with Crimson Skies

[Gadfly2317]

My initial reaction to this game was great. It is a fun, gorgeous looking game. But having spent more time with it, there are some real short comings and disappointments I have with it. Maybe they were just saving some of these things for a sequel.

First, unlike the new Rogue Squadron, I don't see a two player co-op mode for the campaign in CS. Why not? Seems like the missions are perfect for it, considering you've got that useless sidekick Betty half the time. You might as well have a real person be able to control her.

The other MAJOR complaint I have with the game is that it has no other single player modes other than the mission. Lets say I'm sitting at home alone, without live, and just want to do some dogfighting. It only makes sense that this game could have all kinds of options, kind of like the way TimeSplitters II did. You should be able to select an area, set the number of computer controlled enemies, their plane type, set the AI difficulty level on each, and have some great dog fighting. You should be able to set up the number of land based anti-aircraft enemies, etc. You could have single player versions of capture the flag, death match, last man standing, etc. Because as far as I can tell so far, you are stuck playing the linear mission, or live.

Even on two player there are no bot enemies, just you and your friend, flying around trying to kill each other. There should be computer controlled enemies as well, and land based enemies. It is kind of dull just two player dog fights. I've played it with system link as well, and that's better because the more the merrier.

And that leaves us Live. I've played this on Live for several hours and it is truly great; though there is some waiting around for a match to begin. But again, there are only four areas, which is a way too little. I really feel like they short changed the game with some of the single player options I listed above in order to make Live more attractive. Seems kind cheap.

I still think this game is great, but it has a hell of a lot of short comings. Kind makes me look forward to playing the full Rogue Squadron II in Co-op mode. Hopefully there will be a CS sequel that adds all the features and more that I listed above.

[trebor]

That's too bad - Crimson Skies is truly one of the few Xbox games that has had me taking notice of the system.

I've said it once and I'll say it again - the multiplayer aspects of Rebel Strike are the best things about the game. If were talking about a purely single-player aspect, Rogue Leader beats Rebel Strike, for the most part. But the multiplayer alone makes Rebel Strike the best in the series.

A fully developed co-op mode, which happens to be the entire Rogue Leader game, in it's entirety, and multiple versus modes that are easily some of the most entertaining moments I've had with the series.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

so what? nothing on consoles come close to the experience once you take that puppy online.

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\">That's too bad - Crimson Skies is truly one of the few Xbox games that has had me taking notice of the system.

I've said it once and I'll say it again - the multiplayer aspects of Rebel Strike are the best things about the game. If were talking about a purely single-player aspect, Rogue Leader beats Rebel Strike, for the most part. But the multiplayer alone makes Rebel Strike the best in the series.

A fully developed co-op mode, which happens to be the entire Rogue Leader game, in it's entirety, and multiple versus modes that are easily some of the most entertaining moments I've had with the series.</div>


I'm being critical on the pickiest of levels. When the xbox drops to a price that makes it worth it for you--considering the small number of games on it you seem interested in--you should definitely get Crimson Skies. The dog fighting is amazing, the two player mode is fair, and if you ever did get live, it really is a stunning game. The single player story mode is brilliant and a blast.

[trebor]

I'm being critical on the pickiest of levels. When the xbox drops to a price that makes it worth it for you--considering the small number of games on it you seem interested in--you should definitely get Crimson Skies. The dog fighting is amazing, the two player mode is fair, and if you ever did get live, it really is a stunning game. The single player story mode is brilliant and a blast.

It's a tough choice - to wait until the next round of consoles and hope for backwards compatability or to just wait for a price drop.

Crimson Skies, KotOR, Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance 2, Fallout - Brotherhood of Steel, and Deus Ex 2 are the main games that I'm interested in for Xbox. Plus there is a couple of titles in 2004 that will be worth checking out.

I'm on the verge of a purchase between a full-out PC or an Xbox - so you can see why truly exclusive titles are important to that decision. Since many titles I'm interested in are on both platforms.

Buy Rebel Strike.

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\">It's a tough choice - to wait until the next round of consoles and hope for backwards compatability or to just wait for a price drop.

Crimson Skies, KotOR, Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance 2, Fallout - Brotherhood of Steel, and Deus Ex 2 are the main games that I'm interested in for Xbox. Plus there is a couple of titles in 2004 that will be worth checking out.

I'm on the verge of a purchase between a full-out PC or an Xbox - so you can see why truly exclusive titles are important to that decision. Since many titles I'm interested in are on both platforms.

Buy Rebel Strike.</div>


IF you are on the verge there, go with the PC first, especially if you spend a lot of time using it for a lot of things. I picked up a new PC this year and just love the hell out of it. Not that expensive either even with the 19" monitor with the digital surround system. If you get a new system now, you'll be up to speed to play KOTOR, Halo, Vice City, Deus Ex 2, and Doom III. I do consider myself primarily a console gamer, but I love having the PC as sort of a gaming station away from the living room when the fiance and the kids are monopolizing the TVs. And PC gaming, its not like the xbot portayal of "uncomfortably hunching over your little screen." Got a comfy exec-style office chair, and since the moniter is High definition (unlike my current TV) and I'm sitting closer to the monitor and surrounded by the speakers, I'm actually more inserted into the game universe than I am in the recliner with the wavebird sitting like 15 feet from the TV. And the PC is better for the games you mentioned like Deus Ex and KOTOR for too many reasons to even go into.

I think you'd enjoy the xbox. You probably already have a DVD player, but if it dies, and the xbox is down to $149 next year, it'd be a good time to pick up an xbox. Halo II and Fable will be great, and the Conker remake too. And then there will be many inexpensive groovy games to catch up on like Voodoo Vince, Crimson Skies, and the excellent racing games (if you like racing. I get my racing moods, and I've really been liking how great the racing on xbox is. PS2 racing does not cut the mustard. It cuts the cheese.)

2004 is definitely the time to pick up an xbox if you've waited this long. I was going to wait until 2004 since there was so much I already was going to play on GC, including multi-plats like Prince of Persia and Beyon Good and Evil (which will be close enough to the same game on xbox that I don't think it matters.) FF: Crystal Chronicles, and Sword of Mana and of course Mario Kart and 1080. But what the hell. I like a new gadget every so often, it had been 8mos since I'd gotten my new PC, I had some extra money just burning a hole in my pocket, and well, there you go. . . I'm sorta of an xbot now. It is certainly much cooler than PS2. You don't seem to buy a lot of games since you obviously have a life and other interests. That's one thing I like about xbox. It doesn't have the massive volume of titles that PS2 has, but the handful of top notch titles it has are nothing short of incredible. Nintendo fans have long preached "quality over quantity" and I'm starting to feel that applies to xbox too. Xbox really did suck for a very long time there with an anemic library, but finally a very good platformer, a hit RPG, great racing games, the best flight combat game I've ever played. . . yeah, its coming along nicely. And hey, it may be full of PC ports, but the cool thing about that is, you can rent them on your xbox first to see if you like them, and then if you do, you can buy the real version for your smokin' new PC.

(I still think MS is an evil anti-competitive corporation; but then who isn't these days? Welcome to the death of democracy and the apotheosis of the massive corporate oligarchy.)

[trebor]

IF you are on the verge there, go with the PC first, especially if you spend a lot of time using it for a lot of things. I picked up a new PC this year and just love the hell out of it. Not that expensive either even with the 19&quot; monitor with the digital surround system. If you get a new system now, you'll be up to speed to play KOTOR, Halo, Vice City, Deus Ex 2, and Doom III. I do consider myself primarily a console gamer, but I love having the PC as sort of a gaming station away from the living room when the fiance and the kids are monopolizing the TVs. And PC gaming, its not like the xbot portayal of "uncomfortably hunching over your little screen." Got a comfy exec-style office chair, and since the moniter is High definition (unlike my current TV) and I'm sitting closer to the monitor and surrounded by the speakers, I'm actually more inserted into the game universe than I am in the recliner with the wavebird sitting like 15 feet from the TV. And the PC is better for the games you mentioned like Deus Ex and KOTOR for too many reasons to even go into.

Well, I already have a nice 19" monitor, excellent Monsoon speakers and a variety of peripherals for my Mac. So if/when I buy a PC, all that money will go just for the PC itself. Which means however much money I will be plunking down, it will be less than if I had to buy a full set-up.

The Gamecube is the first videogame console I've bought in almost 10 years (not counting various Gameboys over the years), so my main deal has always been computer gaming, albeit Mac gaming. I agree, being close to the monitor and speakers really does help draw you into whatever game one is playing. Plus, I have a nice comfy padded office chair that has had me sitting in comfort for 6 - 8 hour game-a-thons.


I think you'd enjoy the xbox. You probably already have a DVD player, but if it dies, and the xbox is down to $149 next year, it'd be a good time to pick up an xbox. Halo II and Fable will be great, and the Conker remake too. And then there will be many inexpensive groovy games to catch up on like Voodoo Vince, Crimson Skies, and the excellent racing games (if you like racing. I get my racing moods, and I've really been liking how great the racing on xbox is. PS2 racing does not cut the mustard. It cuts the cheese.)

I know for a fact that I would enjoy an Xbox. I would enjoy any gaming console, whether it was PS2, Xbox, N-Gage, Tapwave, PSP, and, of course, the Gamecube. I love playing videogames - my Nintendo-centric viewpoint is strictly for System Wars only.


2004 is definitely the time to pick up an xbox if you've waited this long. I was going to wait until 2004 since there was so much I already was going to play on GC, including multi-plats like Prince of Persia and Beyon Good and Evil (which will be close enough to the same game on xbox that I don't think it matters.) FF: Crystal Chronicles, and Sword of Mana and of course Mario Kart and 1080. But what the hell. I like a new gadget every so often, it had been 8mos since I'd gotten my new PC, I had some extra money just burning a hole in my pocket, and well, there you go. . . I'm sorta of an xbot now. It is certainly much cooler than PS2. You don't seem to buy a lot of games since you obviously have a life and other interests. That's one thing I like about xbox. It doesn't have the massive volume of titles that PS2 has, but the handful of top notch titles it has are nothing short of incredible. Nintendo fans have long preached &quot;quality over quantity&quot; and I'm starting to feel that applies to xbox too. Xbox really did suck for a very long time there with an anemic library, but finally a very good platformer, a hit RPG, great racing games, the best flight combat game I've ever played. . . yeah, its coming along nicely. And hey, it may be full of PC ports, but the cool thing about that is, you can rent them on your xbox first to see if you like them, and then if you do, you can buy the real version for your smokin' new PC.

Xbox is definitely what I will buy if I decide to go the console route instead of the PC route. The PS2 is good, for what it is, but I'm far more interested in the Xbox library over the PS2 library. It's just that the PC library has both of them trumped.

But, like you mentioned, I haven't been gaming much overall lately, because other hobbys are keeping me happy. I'm a big movie fan, and this October and November have been big for movie fans. I bought the Indiana Jones Trilogy, Rush in Rio and I am eagerly awaiting Two Towers Extended Edition and X2.

Plus, I've been addicted to watching Sopranos like a street urchin is addicted to crack - I can't get enough of it.


(I still think MS is an evil anti-competitive corporation; but then who isn't these days? Welcome to the death of democracy and the apotheosis of the massive corporate oligarchy.)

I've been thinking hard about that, being as that whichever route I go, M$ will benefit from it - whether it's Xbox or PC. So far, M$ has not received one red cent from me - ever.

I've come to two conclusions...one being that M$ is only what it is today because consumers allowed it be what it is - so we can only blame ourselves, and two, Bill Gates is actually a philanthropist - he gives more money to charity than the U.S. government does, which isn't such a bad thing to contribute to.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

Maybe if Apple and Linux weren't so hard for the common, computer illiterate to use MS wouldn't be on top but sorry, that's just how it is.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

And veteran Xbox gamers like me take your original complaint here as a grain of salt because I've been on LIVE so long I couldn't care less about the single player version of Not only CS but pretty much any other LIVE compatible game. I understand that you have some problems with it but not being able to play on LIVE is kinda like seeing half of something and making a full judgement...

[trebor]

Maybe if Apple and Linux weren't so hard for the common, computer illiterate to use MS wouldn't be on top but sorry, that's just how it is.

You're probably right about that, but speaking as a Apple user, Macs are way, way easier to use than PC's. Ironic isn't it?

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\">And veteran Xbox gamers like me take your original complaint here as a grain of salt because I've been on LIVE so long I couldn't care less about the single player version of Not only CS but pretty much any other LIVE compatible game. I understand that you have some problems with it but not being able to play on LIVE is kinda like seeing half of something and making a full judgement...</div>

Hey, if your preference is live, that is fine. But a game shouldn't short change the single player experience, not if a company wants to excel. After all, only 10% of the userbase is on Live. You don't make a game that stiff's 90% of the userbase. Crimson Skies, to be a thorough game, should have had more single player options, and more options for the multi-player mode.

Halo II will come loaded with those kind of features, even though it will also be Live.

I can't see Live being a replacement for a good single player or co-op campaign. They are just very different kinds of game experiences.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

can't replace splitsceen co op? Well, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it but I just gotta tell you, get LIVE so you can be all cracked out and hyped like Darwin, CrackMasterMike, Daman, and me...

[Gadfly2317]

<div class=\"smallfont\">can't replace splitsceen co op? Well, that's your opinion and you are entitled to it but I just gotta tell you, get LIVE so you can be all cracked out and hyped like Darwin, CrackMasterMike, Daman, and me...</div>

I don't have live, but my friends house where I take my xbox and play system link on two TV's. . . you can play co-op on two TV's. . .it doesn't have to be split screen. Anyway, he has Live, and I do enjoy it. I'm not sure I want it though. I don't want to be on video games like crack. . .spending 30 hours a week on just one racing game, plus another 30 hours a week on other stuff. What a way to waste your life. Games are entertainment and escape, they shouldn't dominate every free moment.

But seriously, on the topic at hand, I'm not knocking Live at all. It adds massive potential to the games. I very much enjoyed Crimson Skies live. But that is no excuse for short changing the single player options in a game. That diminishes the overall greatness of the game. The full package game will have both. Halo xbox is not online, but look at how endlessly rewarding it is because of all the single player, co-op, and multi-player options. And a bunch of guys in a room playing system link is WAY more fun than playing it online, IMO. But Halo II will undoubtedly have a lot of options PLUS live.

Crimson Skies is great, but I don't think you can argue it wouldn't have been better with some single and multi-player dogfight modes that allowed customizable bots and ground fire enemies.