MS Games Division $357 Million Profit!

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Another quarter in the black for Microsoft's games division. Here is the article from Gamespot:
<b>Last October, Microsoft's entertainment and devices division, the segment of the software giant that includes the Xbox 360 business, posted its first quarterly operating profit. Based on the strength of Halo 3, the division managed to finish the July-September quarter $165 million in the black.

Microsoft's Xbox business proved it isn't a one-hit wonder today when the company released its latest financial results, which saw the division more than double the previous quarter's operating profit. For the company's second fiscal quarter (the three months ended December 31), the entertainment and devices division posted $357 million in operating income on revenues of $3.06 billion.

In a conference call with investors, Microsoft senior vice president and CFO Chris Liddell said the console had reached a record tie ratio of seven games for every system sold, with the gaming division's revenues beating the company's previous investor guidance by $90 million. Although the revenue growth was minor (about 3 percent) over the same period the year before, the company's gaming business had turned an operating loss of $302 million over the 2006 holiday quarter.

For the first half of the fiscal year, the entertainment and devices division's revenues have been up more than 25 percent. For the full year, Microsoft said it expects the segment's revenues to increase 21-24 percent.

The company did not release specific earnings for the Xbox 360 today. However, it did revisit its 2008 Consumer Electronics Show keynote address. In that presentation, Microsoft execs trumpeted the fact that the console generated $3.5 billion in software, hardware, and other revenue from January to November 2007, saying that the total surpasses that of the PlayStation 3 and Wii combined. During today's conference call, Liddell said that for the holiday quarter alone, the total amount spent in the US on Xbox 360 hardware, software, and accessories was twice that of the PS3, and 27 percent more than on the Wii.

The rest of Microsoft's business divisions met or exceeded the company's expectations, and the company brought in total revenues of $16.37 billion, with $6.48 billion in operating income.

</b>

Pretty good numbers, $3.5 Billion in revenue from Jan through Nov' 07, more than PS3 and Wii combined! Holiday numbers for 360 darn near just as good, two times the revenue of the PS3 and 27% more total revenues than Wii. The games attach ratio is the highest ever somewhere between 6-7, right now the 360 is just a machine. I see no reason why it won't be profitable for the rest of its life cycle. MS owns the licenses to the guts of the system, they can control costs, and they have the share of the market that counts, the gamers who buy a lot of games!

[Cuddly Knife]

A couple more of these and they'll break even with the billion-dollar loss they hit with the extendo warranty.

I see this as a good thing, because maybe MS will be willing to keep the 360 around for a few more years than what they did with the XBOX. Even if the PS3 eventually surpasses the 360 in gaming capabilities, devs will still be whipping out some killer games for the system(360), just like what happened with the PS2. It's very strange seeing the reversal roles for all three systems.

[folken001]

I can't stop but be sad for you if you think that this is a good thing. THe only reason why 360 is making $$ for M$ is mostly because all the dollars it saved from making an broken product.

Are you, in a way, saying that it's ok for M$ to do this continuously in the future? Whenever M$ runs into trouble, let's just outsource everything to foreign countries with no quality control what-so-ever. I guess it all about perspective. Some people like to get b1tch slapped and some....don't. You know which group you belong to!

Recently I read an article about Japan's vertical manufacture structure vs Apple and M$'s horizontal structure. It's not a bad read and it sure reminds me why I buy Japan electronics over American's most of the time. I am just happy that i won't be posting a pathetic story about how my console broke down, unlike so many here had.

[Mochan]

Amazing! This is like the 2nd? Or was it 3rd time the Game Division ever went into the black.

[silversparrow]

Amazing! This is like the 2nd? Or was it 3rd time the Game Division ever went into the black.

Third. They were profitable for one quarter in '05, but when they rolled out the 360 they were back in red. This is the first time that they ran a profit for two quarters in a row. Fiscal '08 should be the first profitable year for them.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

I can't stop but be sad for you if you think that this is a good thing. THe only reason why 360 is making $$ for M$ is mostly because all the dollars it saved from making an broken product.

Are you, in a way, saying that it's ok for M$ to do this continuously in the future? Whenever M$ runs into trouble, let's just outsource everything to foreign countries with no quality control what-so-ever. I guess it all about perspective. Some people like to get b1tch slapped and some....don't. You know which group you belong to!

Recently I read an article about Japan's vertical manufacture structure vs Apple and M$'s horizontal structure. It's not a bad read and it sure reminds me why I buy Japan electronics over American's most of the time. I am just happy that i won't be posting a pathetic story about how my console broke down, unlike so many here had.

Vertical manufacturing is nothing new and was moved away from in the 70s and 80s by most american companies because they realized people who specialized in manufacturing components or parts could do a better job more efficiently than one company doing everything in house.

A horizontal structure had nothing to do with the bad job MS did with the 360, they just did a bad job period. But like I said before I've gotten two great years of gaming from the 360, none yet from PS3. So it doesn't matter how great the PS3 is built. Both companies had problems. MS had problems with its hardware and Sony had problems with getting timely games, quality games, they were overpriced and didn't have a good SKU, network problems and all of this resulted in poor games and services.

Now i'm not mad at MS because personally i've been relatively lucky, i'll be sans 360 for a few weeks and hopefully no problems going forward. I'm not mad at Sony, i've just got on board with the PS3 and hopefully the games will pick up. But make no mistake about it, 360 has provided 2 of the best years ever in gaming and last year may have been the very best year ever by any platform based on the number of hits MS had for 360. This is PS3's second year, let's see if it can even come close to 360's second year, if it does hats off to Sony. We all know everything there is to know about RROD, bad systems are still out there so it will linger for a while, but i'm betting the issue has been fixed with Falcon. Not to say no falcon systems will fail, but i'm sure the failure rate will be normal. Anyway, you hold a grudge, I can't wait to get my 360 back and I can't wait to play some good games on PS3 too.

[folken001]

It sure has something to do with how the products are made. Apple is another notorious inferior product maker. How many people have problem with their ipods? Dead pixels and short lived batterys. They are also a result of horzontal manufacturing, or so I read. Unless you are saying Apple just happens to make bad products too. I suppose there is this unknown yet contagious disease between only American companies? Two companies with the same manufacture structure?

How long is a console suppose to last? And how long did yours last? Think about that. There's nothing to be happy about. First of all, M$ made money. Not you. 2ndly, they made money OFF of you (in the most literal sense). I don't have a 360, so there's nothing for me to hold a grudge for. I am jus glad that I don't have to deal with BS with my PS3. If I found out one day Sony made my playstation breakage proned on purpose just so they can make more money and my playstation actually broke, that would be it for me.

All I am saying is that I pity those who have been taking advantage of and actually be happy with it. You can say that all the fun you have with 360 makes it all worthwhile but I don't understand why you have to pay extra for a machine to do what it supposes to do. Do you get free games? If not, what are you so happy about? Seriously? What's your mental disease?

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Of course it has something to do with how the products are made. Apple is another notorious inferior products makers. How many people have problem with their ipods? Dead pixels and short lived batterys. They are the result of horzontal manufacturing, or so I read. Unless you are saying Apple just happens to make bad products too. I suppose it's contagious disease between only American companies?

How long is a console suppose to last? And how long did yours last? Think about that. There's nothing to be happy about. First of all, M$ made money. Not you. 2ndly, they made money OFF of you (in the most literal sense). I don't have a 360, so there's nothing for me to hold a grudge for. I am jus glad that I don't have to deal with BS with my PS3. If I found out one day Sony made my playstation breakage proned on purpose just so they can make more money and my playstation actually broke, that would be it for me.

All I am saying is that I pity those who have been taking advantage of and actually be happy with it. You can say that all the fun you have with 360 makes it all worth it but I don't understand why you have to pay extra for a machine to do what it supposes to do. Do you get free games? If not, what are you so happy about? Seriously? What's your mental disease?

Dude you are seriously uneducated, just about every manufacturer uses horizontal manufacturing. Vertical manufacturing is why Sony got killed by Apple with digital music players and it is also why Sony is going to get killed by Microsoft eventually in the video game industry. While Sony takes years and years to design engineer fabricate their stuff design the software and middle and o/s etc, other companies grab off the shelf parts or have specialist modify a part, and they get their products to market faster and can adapt to consumer tastes and desires faster. They can react faster and get newer and newer products to market, their costs are lower, for example Sony is mated to the PS3 because they've sunk so much $$ into it. They have to get a 10 year lifecycle from it, while in 2 years Microsoft can release the XBOX 720 which could make the PS3 look like a graphing calculator. Even Sony is getting away from a full vertical integration model, the cell was a partnership with IBM and Toshiba and the GPU is by Nvidia. But Sony could have definitely used some help with their middleware, their online network etc.

Look at Apple the first gen IPODs look like something from the Flintstone's era compared to the IPOD Touch, and you can bet this year the IPOD Touch will see a drastic improvement. The IPhone will also see a drastic improvement. And I think the quality of the IPOD is pretty high. Early on there were some battery issues, but i've got an 80GB unit and the battery will go a few days before I even have to recharge it if i'm just listening to music. It is rated for 24 hours but it routinely goes way past that and its over a year old now.

It is too inefficient to do everything in house, you can see you get the same performance from 360 with cheaper parts as the PS3 which originally cost Sony what $900 to manufacture.

[joquito]

Vertical manufacturing is nothing new and was moved away from in the 70s and 80s by most american companies because they realized people who specialized in manufacturing components or parts could do a better job more efficiently than one company doing everything in house.

A horizontal structure had nothing to do with the bad job MS did with the 360, they just did a bad job period. But like I said before I've gotten two great years of gaming from the 360, none yet from PS3. So it doesn't matter how great the PS3 is built. Both companies had problems. MS had problems with its hardware and Sony had problems with getting timely games, quality games, they were overpriced and didn't have a good SKU, network problems and all of this resulted in poor games and services.

Now i'm not mad at MS because personally i've been relatively lucky, i'll be sans 360 for a few weeks and hopefully no problems going forward. I'm not mad at Sony, i've just got on board with the PS3 and hopefully the games will pick up. But make no mistake about it, 360 has provided 2 of the best years ever in gaming and last year may have been the very best year ever by any platform based on the number of hits MS had for 360. This is PS3's second year, let's see if it can even come close to 360's second year, if it does hats off to Sony. We all know everything there is to know about RROD, bad systems are still out there so it will linger for a while, but i'm betting the issue has been fixed with Falcon. Not to say no falcon systems will fail, but i'm sure the failure rate will be normal. Anyway, you hold a grudge, I can't wait to get my 360 back and I can't wait to play some good games on PS3 too.

Your post hits on some interesting points. I for one don't think this board is a microcosm for the entire gaming community, but I am sure that one can find some correlations. Many 360 owners on this board have purchased PS3s and are moving their multi-platform purchases to the PS3. The initial purchase of a PS3 may not be a result of RROD, but purchasing multi-platform titles on the PS3 over the 360 seems to be directly linked to RROD. Can this be the start of a boost in PS3 software sales?

[silversparrow]

It is too inefficient to do everything in house, you can see you get the same performance from 360 with cheaper parts as the PS3 which originally cost Sony what $900 to manufacture.

The PS3 isn't entirely built in-house by Sony. You've got the RSX by Nvidia, XDR DRAM by Rambus, and Cell partners IBM and Toshiba (now the sole manufacturer of the CPU).

[theWacoKid]

Halo 3 released very late in the previous fiscal quarter, so Halo 3's sales still contributed greatly to the latest fiscal quarter. So, instead of getting all the effects in just one quarter, as before with Halo 2, its split between the two.

Frankly, considering that MS rakes in all this freebie money with their $50/year online cover charges, what I can't figure is why they're not profitable every quarter. They've done virtually no price reductions, the xbots move in herds buying the latest hot game, they have xbox live, outrageously overpriced peripherals, nickel and dime you over xbox live, get money from advertisers to plague your dashboard, etc, etc. These guys should be rolling in dough.

[theWacoKid]

The PS3 isn't entirely built in-house by Sony. You've got the RSX by Nvidia, XDR DRAM by Rambus, and Cell partners IBM and Toshiba (now the sole manufacturer of the CPU).

Nvidia acts only as engineers for the RSX, they do not manufacture it.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Halo 3 released very late in the previous fiscal quarter, so Halo 3's sales still contributed greatly to the latest fiscal quarter. So, instead of getting all the effects in just one quarter, as before with Halo 2, its split between the two.

Frankly, considering that MS rakes in all this freebie money with their $50/year online cover charges, what I can't figure is why they're not profitable every quarter. They've done virtually no price reductions, the xbots move in herds buying the latest hot game, they have xbox live, <b>outrageously overpriced peripherals</b>, nickel and dime you over xbox live, get money from advertisers to plague your dashboard, etc, etc. These guys should be rolling in dough.

Nintendo is the king of selling peripherals. Those Wi-motes and Zappers etc. are selling like hotcakes in the middle of winter. And I think they cost just as much if not more than a 360 controller. Sony does pretty good with peripherals too. MS includes a remote with the XBOX which is real handy for watching movies, Sony doesn't. MS includes a headset for LIVE, Sony doesn't. When Sony releases rumble controllers they are going to make a killing right there as everyone upgrades their controllers. Pretty much all of these companies are trying to rip you off, its up to you as a consumer to not get ripped off. I spent way more money last generation than i'm spending now. And i'm keeping a low inventory of games by trading stuff in as soon as I finish it, unless I feel i'm going to get replay value out of it, and then buying used games where appropriate or buying games on sale, and of course renting.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Your post hits on some interesting points. I for one don't think this board is a microcosm for the entire gaming community, but I am sure that one can find some correlations. Many 360 owners on this board have purchased PS3s and are moving their multi-platform purchases to the PS3. The initial purchase of a PS3 may not be a result of RROD, but purchasing multi-platform titles on the PS3 over the 360 seems to be directly linked to RROD. Can this be the start of a boost in PS3 software sales?

I don't think so, people have been getting RROD long before me and it hasn't helped the PS3 with multiplats or software in general. I plan to migrate most of my purchases to the PS3 unless I get a Falcon system back. Even if I get a Falcon system back i'll probably do more PS3 purchases than I planned just to kind of even things out and I like playing on my newer TV. Still I don't think any trend is happening on a big enough scale to have an impact on the charts. PS3 got destroyed over the holidays in terms of software sales.

I think there is still a lot more incentive to buy for the 360 despite RROD, rumble, LIVE, gamerpoints and other reasons. For example GTA4 has exclusive content, no definitive word on Splinter Cell coming to PS3, if it does will be a delayed release, Drunken is saying Frontlines is no longer coming to PS3(haven't seen this news myself), Ubisoft is struggling to get Haze off the ground, so it looks like developers are still having problems with PS3. So this stigma is going to hound the PS3 for a lot of consumers despite the fact there are individuals like myself with both systems. It doesn't kill me to switch to PS3 a little because I don't game online nearly as much as I did before, but there are a lot of hardcore gamers who live and die by XBL.

Anyway I don't see myself buying many multiplats personally this year. DMC4 i'm going to rent because it really isn't my thing, after watching media of it, i'm certain I no longer want to buy it. I've never been a GTA fan, and probably won't buy this either. Never been a big Resident Evil guy either, though if I see something that changes my mind i'd buy it. For the most part I see myself sticking to the big exclusives Fable2, Too Human, Killzone2, Metal Gear4, Gears2, etc.

[DrunkenThumbmaster]

Drunken is saying Frontlines is no longer coming to PS3(haven't seen this news myself), Ubisoft is struggling to get Haze off the ground, so it looks like developers are still having problems with PS3.

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/01/23/thq-cans-frontlines-ps3-juiced-and-stuntman-franchises/

There still obvious issues with PS3 development. Frontlines looks to be a good game the demo was single player and fun much better than Battlefields singleplayer. It may contend with Battlefield as a multiplayer game as well and much more appealling than Warhawk. Plus it has dedicated servers on live something no game has really done.

[theWacoKid]

Nintendo is the king of selling peripherals. Those Wi-motes and Zappers etc. are selling like hotcakes in the middle of winter. And I think they cost just as much if not more than a 360 controller. Sony does pretty good with peripherals too. MS includes a remote with the XBOX which is real handy for watching movies, Sony doesn't. MS includes a headset for LIVE, Sony doesn't. When Sony releases rumble controllers they are going to make a killing right there as everyone upgrades their controllers. Pretty much all of these companies are trying to rip you off, its up to you as a consumer to not get ripped off. I spent way more money last generation than i'm spending now. And i'm keeping a low inventory of games by trading stuff in as soon as I finish it, unless I feel i'm going to get replay value out of it, and then buying used games where appropriate or buying games on sale, and of course renting.

Nothing beats $50/year/account like xbox live. Cha-ching! Hey, MS hasn't included a shortie remote with the xbox 360 premium skus since the early launch units, wtf are you babbling about? Oh, you want wifi, cha-ching, still $99US after two years on the market. Oh, I'm sorry, you want a larger hdd, pony up $180 for our proprietary hdd which will remain $180 for the next decade and can't be used for anything else. You want a mem card to back up your game saves, buy our overpriced can't you use it for anything else proprietary mem cards, cha-ching. You don't have rechargeable batteries, for your controllers, we'll sell you some. Want an obsolete hidef movie player, still $179.99? What a bargoon. Themes, pay up, gamerpics, pay up. Stupid ass faceplates, pay up. Wireless headset, you want to use your bluetooth cellphone headset, sorry, pay up. Don't like that obnoxious local advertising on your dashboard, tuff noogies, live with it.

MS is the undisputed ripoff king of selling overpriced underperforming peripherals. They're trade up artists. Hell, FS over here was selling old units courtesy of MS during xmas, that didn't include an hdmi port and a lot of them came back defective. Swell company, palming off old junkie units to purchasers thinking they were getting the new units with the hdmi port and the downsized cpu chipset. I guess overcharging canadians on the exchange rate wasn't good enough for MS, they had to dump their old leftover junk from the back of the warehouse to us as well.

FU#$ MS and the horse they rode in on. They're the only ones charging for online play, the only ones with proprietary mem cards and hdds, the only ones charging for wifi, the only ones charging for themes and gamerpics, etc, etc.

And who's to blame, xbot stooges who willingly bend over and don't mind taking it up the ass from their master, whether the ky jelly has been applied or not. Oooh, the games, the games are soooo awesome!

If you guys all collectively decided not to renew your xbox live subscriptions, MS would have no choice but to make xbox live free the way it should be. But, as long as you keep paying their cover charge they do nothing for, they'll keep charging. Cha-ching, cha-ching, cha-ching!

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Nothing beats $50/year/account like xbox live. Cha-ching! Hey, MS hasn't included a shortie remote with the xbox 360 premium skus since the early launch units, wtf are you babbling about? Oh, you want wifi, cha-ching, still $99US after two years on the market. Oh, I'm sorry, you want a larger hdd, pony up $180 for our proprietary hdd which will remain $180 for the next decade and can't be used for anything else. You want a mem card to back up your game saves, buy our overpriced can't you use it for anything else proprietary mem cards, cha-ching. You don't have rechargeable batteries, for your controllers, we'll sell you some. Want an obsolete hidef movie player, still $179.99? What a bargoon. Themes, pay up, gamerpics, pay up. Stupid ass faceplates, pay up. Wireless headset, you want to use your bluetooth cellphone headset, sorry, pay up. Don't like that obnoxious local advertising on your dashboard, tuff noogies, live with it.

MS is the undisputed ripoff king of selling overpriced underperforming peripherals. They're trade up artists. Hell, FS over here was selling old units courtesy of MS during xmas, that didn't include an hdmi port and a lot of them came back defective. Swell company, palming off old junkie units to purchasers thinking they were getting the new units with the hdmi port and the downsized cpu chipset. I guess overcharging canadians on the exchange rate wasn't good enough for MS, they had to dump their old leftover junk from the back of the warehouse to us as well.

FU#$ MS and the horse they rode in on. They're the only ones charging for online play, the only ones with proprietary mem cards and hdds, the only ones charging for wifi, the only ones charging for themes and gamerpics, etc, etc.

And who's to blame, xbot stooges who willingly bend over and don't mind taking it up the ass from their master, whether the ky jelly has been applied or not. Oooh, the games, the games are soooo awesome!

If you guys all collectively decided not to renew your xbox live subscriptions, MS would have no choice but to make xbox live free the way it should be. But, as long as you keep paying their cover charge they do nothing for, they'll keep charging. Cha-ching, cha-ching, cha-ching!

And if your 360 never broke you'd still be a stooge willingly bending over. I agree with you that most of that crap is a rip-off, face-plates, memory cards, complete rip offs. But last generation when XBOX had HDD and you didn't need memory cards, nobody was calling Sony and Nintendo rip-off artists for charging for proprietary memory cards. Now that MS wisely does it, they are evil. If you don't want a memory card, don't buy one. I don't have one. If you don't want a battery charger don't buy one, use Duracell rechargeable batteries. Most of the stuff you are crying about can be avoided. Except for XBLA, but XBLA is the one thing that yeah every stooge will pay for, because we all believe it is well worth the money, just like you did. Especially when you have PC games charging $15 per month for one game!

You like Sony's no charge model cool, I don't want to hear you crying when you play GT5 Prologue and can't talk while you race, or can't invite your friends only to a game, you just have to race with strangers. And in cases like BO:P don't cry when you can't use custom soundtracks. I just saw that Fivespot posted in the PS3 forums COD4 is unplayable over the PSN, even after the patch, so he stopped playing it. You get what you pay for! Pay nothing, then I guess you cannot complain if you get spotty service. You even had the editor of Game Informer magazine in the letter from the editor imploring Sony to start charging a nominal monthly fee and institute the same level of service and quality MS has with XBLA.

I'm all with you about RROD, but you can't change the past so stop beating a dead horse. MS took it on the chin and are paying out the arse for RROD, as well they should. But all the other stuff is just malarky! MS was praised at one point for offering a $199 HD-DVD player, the cheapest way to get into HD for consumers, but now that the format is failing, you wanna blame Microsoft. Guess what, they didn't force it down our throats, they didn't use us like Sony did. But Sony damn sure used you guys with a $600 console that had nothing to play for damn near a year, but you were happy about that.

Each console currently has its positives and negatives. These aren't new entities any longer. Certainly consumers who are still supporting 360 and dissing PS3 are well aware of what each console has to offer. And certainly consumers aren't forced to buy everything each console has to offer. I'm grateful PS3 has Wi-Fi at the same time I knew it didn't pack in a HDMI cable, remote, or headset or have rumble in its controllers. So I did the math and figured I'd still buy it. I wasn't hoodwinked, I knew when I bought my HD-DVD unit for 360 the format could fail, but I made the decision anyway. This is a hobby hopefully, most hobbies are a waste of money to an outside observer. Most people support their hobbies with disposable money. Most hobbies offer alternatives and have fanboys. When someone pays $200 to see a Knicks game and I watch it on TV for free certainly I can say I saw what you saw for free sucker, but how can I measure how much enjoyment they feel they got for their money. You know damn well why 360 is still hot, so stop acting ignorant. The PS3 will be just as hot, if it does one thing, deliver great games, everything else is just gravy. Some people eat the gravy and some don't.

[DrunkenThumbmaster]

Fvck Canada!

[NEO-360]

It sure has something to do with how the products are made. Apple is another notorious inferior product maker. How many people have problem with their ipods? Dead pixels and short lived batterys. They are also a result of horzontal manufacturing, or so I read. Unless you are saying Apple just happens to make bad products too. I suppose there is this unknown yet contagious disease between only American companies? Two companies with the same manufacture structure?

How long is a console suppose to last? And how long did yours last? Think about that. There's nothing to be happy about. First of all, M$ made money. Not you. 2ndly, they made money OFF of you (in the most literal sense). I don't have a 360, so there's nothing for me to hold a grudge for. I am jus glad that I don't have to deal with BS with my PS3. If I found out one day Sony made my playstation breakage proned on purpose just so they can make more money and my playstation actually broke, that would be it for me.

All I am saying is that I pity those who have been taking advantage of and actually be happy with it. You can say that all the fun you have with 360 makes it all worthwhile but I don't understand why you have to pay extra for a machine to do what it supposes to do. Do you get free games? If not, what are you so happy about? Seriously? What's your mental disease?

Need a reminder?

Software($1.3 Billion in Nov.-up 61 percent from last year)

1.Call Of Duty 4(Xbox 360) 1.57 million
2.Call Of Duty 4(PS3) 444,000

3.Assassin's Creed(Xbox 360) 980,000
4.Assassin's Creed(PS3) 377,000

Consoles(1.1 Billion in Nov- up 41 percent since last Nov)

360-770,000(almost double what it did in October)
PS3-466,000(biggest sales increase from October of all platforms due to price drop)

Thats basically was the remainder of 2007. Now if thats any indication of the future holds you might as well keep alot of kleenex handy Capt. Sony. Because if the best you can do is talk about how well the PS3 is doing in Japan & Europe and crying about red ring nonsense you might as well pull out the white flag now. It isnt going to get any better. Even after R:FOM II & MGS4 comes and goes.:cool:

[silversparrow]

SCE is also turning up a profit (http://uk.reuters.com/article/technology-media-telco-SP/idUKSP12922620080131?feedType=RSS&feedName=technology-media-telco-SP), presumably with the sales of the PS2 and PSP.