NPD November, Playstation Who?

[Shinjifei]

Well Nintendo is still putting up #'s that really really really are mind boggling and Sony's #'s don't look as good as what they were saying the week after black Friday.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6184008.html

[Gamer From '78]

Well Nintendo is still putting up #'s that really really really are mind boggling and Sony's #'s don't look as good as what they were saying the week after black Friday.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/6184008.html

US GAME HARDWARE SALES, NOVEMBER 2007
Nintendo DS - 1.53 million
Nintendo Wii - 981,000
Xbox 360 - 770,000
PlayStation Portable - 567,000
PlayStation 2 - 496,000
PlayStation 3 - 466,000

Sony's numbers were BS. That's pretty clear. What we are seeing is that consumers weren't holding off on a PS3 purchase en-masse because of the price-point. The PS3 now sits at $399 and $499 for the two SKUs. In contrast, the 360 Elite sells for $479 and the Premium for $349.

All the Blu-Ray in the world isn't saving Sony. Even with GOOD games like Uncharted and Ratchet & Clank showing up, sales are still far below that of the 360. Microsoft has stolen the "mindshare" or whatever you want to call it. They are viewed as the #1 choice for true next-gen (aside from Wii which is a different story altogether!).

As for the Wii, I just cannot believe it. It's a real-life phenomenon. Nintendo has shown that they still have the magic. Super Mario Galaxy is probably the #1 contender for GOTY. Add in fantastic & above-average titles this year including (but not limited to) Super Paper Mario, Metroid Prime 3-Corruption, Resident Evil Umbrella Chronicles, and budget games like Link's Crossbow Training, Resident Evil 4 and Wii Play and Nintendo has clearly shown their dominance once again on a worldwide scale. I wonder, if Yamauchi were still in charge, where would Nintendo be today since he was running the company into the ground when he "retired?"

I eagerly await next year's batch of games for both the 360 and Wii. Rygar and Super Smash Bros. Brawl are both must-haves for me on the Wii as is Mario-Kart, and stuff like Ninja Gaiden 2, Halo Wars, Soul Calibur IV, Splinter Cell Conviction, Devil May Cry 4 and other are too good to pass up on the 360.

[Fivespot]

I expected PS3 sales to be higher but then again I've personally seen more holiday shoppers buying XBOX 360's than PS3's.

[Cuddly Knife]

Even against my excellent video game advice, people are still picking the 360 over the PS3. No matter how great of a case that I make for the PS3, they want the heavy-hitting games that they see on tv, so the 360 is their only true gaming option. Idiots.

[Gamer From '78]

Even against my excellent video game advice, people are still picking the 360 over the PS3. No matter how great of a case that I make for the PS3, they want the heavy-hitting games that they see on tv, so the 360 is their only true gaming option. Idiots.

You forgot to put a :rolleyes: at the end Cuddly!

But for me, the PS3 still isn't worth the money. I just recently picked up a Dreamcast system off eBay along with Crazy Taxi, Soul Calibur, Chu Chu Rocket and Virtua Fighter 3tb.

I will continue to wait on the PS3. By the time Metal Gear Solid 4 comes out, stuff like Resistance, Heavenly Sword and Ninja Gaiden Sigma which would be my purchases for the system will drop (hopefully) in price, Rumble controllers will be out and we might even see another price drop. :cool:

[Shinjifei]

Might as well add the software #'s from the article...

No first party games to be seen in the list for Sony.

TOP 10 GAME SOFTWARE TITLES, NOVEMBER 2007
1) Call Of Duty 4: Modern Warfare (360) - Activision (Corp) - Nov 2007 - 1.57 million
2) Super Mario Galaxy (Wii) - Nintendo - Nov 2007 - 1.12 million
3) Assassin's Creed (360) - Ubisoft - Nov 2007 - 980,000
4) Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock (PS2) Activision Oct 2007 - 967,000
5) Wii Play (with remote) (Wii)- Nintendo - Feb 2007 - 564,000
6) Mass Effect (360) - Microsoft Nov 2007 - 473,000
7) Call Of Duty 4: Modern Warfare (PS3) - Activision Nov 2007 - 444,000
8) Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock (Wii) - Activision Oct 2007 - 426,000
9) Halo 3 (360) - Microsoft - Sep 2007 - 387,000
10) Assassin's Creed (PS3) - Ubisoft - Nov 2007 - 377,000

[silversparrow]

Sony didn't sell as many PS3s as they hoped, but I don't think MS got the slam dunk they hoped for either. Even with the huge selection of 360 games released this year (many of which were critically acclaimed), they've only got the PS3 sales beat by a factor of 1.6x. That's not what I would call complete domination.

Also, these are only US sales. Factor in Japan and Europe and you will find the total sales of both consoles worldwide to be almost equal.

As for the Wii, Nintendo has propelled itself past the competition quite nicely after the average sales of the GC. It's not exactly on the same tier as the 360 and PS3 since many of the games for it are unique and can't be found elsewhere, or in other cases have features that are only suitable for the Wiimote. Likewise, many bleeding edge multi-plat games for the PS3/360 won't see the light of day on the Wii. Not a bad formula by Nintendo though since the Wii appeals to both veteran gamers and newcomers alike. I wonder how long the demand will continue to be higher than supply.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

This isn't a war, it's a slaughter! 360 is beatin' PS3 worse than Mayweather beat that kid Hatton.

Late summer Mochan, Whacko, Illy, Folken, Slade, Zilla all said after Bungie left, after EA bought Bioware, after the RROD, Microsoft was going to get out of the business, and that things had turned a corner for PS3. They couldn't have been more wrong, just like they've been wrong about this entire gen. MS has had a brilliant strategy from the beginning and I just wonder how uglier things would be for Sony without RROD?

I have a PS3 and the system is already dry after a month barely! R&C is horrible, Uncharted is a little shy of great, and that's it. I was in Blockbuster last night looking for a PS3 game and the only game left i'm interested in is RFOM and that was out! Once I play RFOM I guess i'll turn off my PS3 until MGS4 turns up. I did watch Reign Over Me on Blu-ray last night, so I guess it will be a movie player.

Nintendo and Wii, what can u say. Nintendo is definitely growing the base of gamers, really impressive numbers but equally weak software numbers. They are good for the industry and there is definitely room in the casual crowd. All I can say is thank goodness for variety, Nintendo figured there was a market out there for their vision and they were right, good job.

Hey if Sony can't sell 500,000 units over November with Black Friday, they are in trouble! If they don't have a game that can debut with 1 million sold, they are in trouble. Look at the COD4 numbers, 1.5 million on 360, is it really even necessary to do a PS3 version? How much better could the game had of been if they just focused on the 360, and do u think they are going to break even with whatever it cost them to make a PS3 version? I doubt it, but then again the game is so cheap when u think about it, it probably didn't cost much. Just spruce up the COD2 engine is all they did.

Surprised Mass Effect's numbers are so low. I can't wait to play the game, but I have to since it is on my XMAS list, it has been incredibly painful avoiding this game for so long.

[slade]

Hardware to software tie ratios are as follows:

PS3 4.01
Wii 3.86 (not including Wii Sports)
360 6.85

Overall hardware units were up 26% y/y counting current and next gen consoles and handheld sales. The PS3 was up 285% sequentially and 137% y/y and the tie ratio improved to 4.01 from last month's 3.82. The Wii increased 89% sequentially and 106% y/y, with a tie ratio of 3.86, not including the Wii Sports title bundled with the system. The Xbox 360 was up 51% y/y and up 110% sequentially, while maintaining a strong life-to-date tie ratio of 6.85. NDS sales rose 67% y/y, while PSP increased 38%.

[Tappy_Tibbons]

Good job to MS and Nintendo

although the only software that sells for Wii and DS is junk w/ few exceptions...how many Hannah Montana and High School musical games can Nintendo sell to parents? Sure...Wii gets a good game every few months...would love to play MP3, SMG, SSBB, and new Mario kart, but what else is there? Filler with gimmicks, that's what...and the same can be said for the DS...filler with maybe 1% good games.

LOL @ sony...trying to market Ratchet and Clank and Uncharted...the 2 games that would supposedly save the PS3 with exceptional quality above all else are complete an utter failures...ROFL...the only games selling on PS3 are available on 360 and they are the same types of games in abundance on the 360 and in limited supply on PS3...you know why? Because MS has succeeded in making the public hate the lame crap games on the Playstation brand.

[Fivespot]

Even against my excellent video game advice, people are still picking the 360 over the PS3. No matter how great of a case that I make for the PS3, they want the heavy-hitting games that they see on tv, so the 360 is their only true gaming option. Idiots.

My thoughts exactly. Love the 360 but this whole RROD debacle really has me irked and as a result I'm buying more multiplat titles for the PS3.

Recommended the PS3 to my cous last month and he bought one per my advice. So there's at least one who listened.

[Gamer From '78]

Sony didn't sell as many PS3s as they hoped, but I don't think MS got the slam dunk they hoped for either. Even with the huge selection of 360 games released this year (many of which were critically acclaimed), they've only got the PS3 sales beat by a factor of 1.6x. That's not what I would call complete domination.

Also, these are only US sales. Factor in Japan and Europe and you will find the total sales of both consoles worldwide to be almost equal.

As for the Wii, Nintendo has propelled itself past the competition quite nicely after the average sales of the GC. It's not exactly on the same tier as the 360 and PS3 since many of the games for it are unique and can't be found elsewhere, or in other cases have features that are only suitable for the Wiimote. Likewise, many bleeding edge multi-plat games for the PS3/360 won't see the light of day on the Wii. Not a bad formula by Nintendo though since the Wii appeals to both veteran gamers and newcomers alike. I wonder how long the demand will continue to be higher than supply.

Looking at worldwide figures, it's no "slam-dunk" as you put it for Microsoft and the 360. As you pointed out, worldwide, the two systems sell roughly equal on a global basis. But it just has to sting like a biatch for Sony when last gen, they outsold the 360 worldwide by nearly a 4:1 margin and this gen, they are barely running at a 1:1 ratio.

I read somewhere (not sure how true) that the Wii is close to the total sales that Gamecube made in five years. True or not, sales are incredible and I have never seen demand be so strong for ANY game console for this length of time. eBay scalpers are still making a mint off this thing!

And no matter what any gamer thinks of Nintendo, their games or their current strategy, more game sales to people of all ages benefits everyone. I don't think it's too far fetched of an idea that people who never played games before the Wii and saw gaming as a kid thing may see it differently now. I imagine that alot of moms & pops who have started to tinker with games thanks to the DS and Wii will come to realize that games can be as enjoyable or moreso than movies. Fans of Sci-Fi would go ga-ga over stuff like Mass Effect and Assassin's Creed. Hell, even my jaded father who HATES videogames was watching a trailer I downloaded for Mass Effect and said that it looked very cool. :cool:

[Jyoharl]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Microsoft has 2007 in the bag. No way in Hell is Sony catching up to them. And as for Nintendo, they're having a great year, maybe one of the best years they EVER had....

But 2008 is right around the corner. When that yearly mega ball drops, we'll be in a new year...sales and product will be audited, the fiscal year will reset, and then reality will kick in. Sony isn't trying to make a point with the PS3 anymore, their foot is in the door. Their pushing power is going to be fierce and everyone can see that. Microsoft is clearly the jukebox hero starting this race, so all they have to do is keep at the top, but now that they're not by themselves anymore, this won't be easy. And Nintendo? Gimmicks will only get them but so far. I don't know about everyone else, but playing the Wii with my friends is an option....not a requirement. I'm waiting for that epic RPG, that masterpiece shooter that has only been promised by 1 title on the Wii....casual gamers buy the games and move on. Hardcore gamers come back for more...they'd be smart to cater.

[ilnadmy]

I think this is as good a thread to link this video:

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I forget who says this in the video, but the point comes up that Microsoft didn't really slam-dunk this year given the games released. After all, the ace up their sleeve, their heavy hitter, their money-printing machine Halo 3 was released this year along with some completely hyped and looked forward-to games like BioShock and Mass Effect. These are all complete 360 exclusives, and yet the 360 is barely managing a 1.6:1 sales advantage over the PS3. The PS3 had Ratchet and Clank and Uncharted, true, but those aren't the big Sony juggernauts. Metal Gear Solid 4 is a juggernaut. Final Fantasy XIII is a juggernaut. God of War 3 is a juggernaut. Then there are the huge Japanese multiplats like Resident Evil 5 and Devil May Cry 4 which, let's face it, are more likely to move PS3s than 360s.

When all's said and done, while Microsoft won this year, I don't think they're sitting quite as comfortably as they would have you believe.

[silversparrow]

That video looks like it was shot back in October, just around the time the PS3 price drop to $400 was announced. Since then sales have almost tripled. I agree with Pachter (the guy sitting in the middle) that there's a lot of untapped sales potential. $400 is still more than the launching price of previous console generations.

A recent survey found that the PS2 is still the most played system (http://kotaku.com/gaming/notag/ps2-most-played-console-ps3-least-played-282743.php) in a lot of people's homes. So once the PS3 goes down to $300, and it's pretty much a given by next year's holiday season, it'll be selling more than it is now. The titles that ilnadmy mentioned, plus the next GT installment, will be big time sales catalysts.

[Mochan]

Sony didn't sell as many PS3s as they hoped, but I don't think MS got the slam dunk they hoped for either.

MS didn't get the slam dunk they wanted with the 360 -- Nintendo did with the Wii.

[Mochan]

Late summer Mochan, Whacko, Illy, Folken, Slade, Zilla all said after Bungie left, after EA bought Bioware, after the RROD, Microsoft was going to get out of the business, and that things had turned a corner for PS3. They couldn't have been more wrong, just like they've been wrong about this entire gen. MS has had a brilliant strategy from the beginning and I just wonder how uglier things would be for Sony without RROD?


Don't count your chickens yet our predictions were for a turnaround in 2008, as your selective memory fails to register.


Surprised Mass Effect's numbers are so low. I can't wait to play the game, but I have to since it is on my XMAS list, it has been incredibly painful avoiding this game for so long.

It's a crap game from Bioware, what do you expect? Then again, "crap" games like Call of Duty 4 can sell 1.5 million so maybe Mass Effect just got unlucky. Or as Neo would put it, it just "wasn't as popular."

[thelastword]

and stuff like Ninja Gaiden 2, Halo Wars, Soul Calibur IV, Splinter Cell Conviction, Devil May Cry 4 and other are too good to pass up on the 360.Once the games lead on the PS3, it will perform better there. Capcom starts off on the PC and then ports it over to the consoles and move on from there. DMC4 however is a game built more to the tune of the PS3, it looks better on the PS3 and performs better there as well. There is no way anyone should be subjected to playing a DMC game on the xbox pad, trying switching weapons on the fly with xbox triggers and try the same on the dual shock 3/sixaxis. The PS3 controller is simply superior for the majority of genres out there and it's on equal footing on the rest. Try playing one of the two copies of VF5-360 out there, that's with the 360 dpad, there's simply no contest when it comes to the superior DPAD on the SIXAXIS/DS3, and that applies to the gorgeous looking SOUL CALIBUR4, TEKKEN6 and soon STREETFIGHTER 4.


Action games and fighters are always better played on the PS pad. Sigma controlled smoother imo and so will DMC4. In NG2, there's weapons switching says Itagaki, but it's gimped, because the game pauses, (not so real-time). DMC3 had realtime weapon switching, so does DMC4. A superior setup in terms of controls and hardware, will always win out if it's the main sku, the limitations of NG2 are already telling.


I'm a big Rygar fan, but Rygar Wii won't be as special as the first, it's simply a port where the main char has a blondish look and a clothing change, it looks worse than the PS2 version IMO.

[Glockstar]

The PS3 now sits at $399 and $499 for the two SKUs. In contrast, the 360 Elite sells for $479 and the Premium for $349.

And don't forget the Arcade version (which is no longer "retarded") is priced at $279.


-


Comparing some numbers:
NPD numbers for the 360 for November 2006 - the 360's second November - were 511,000. Average numbers... but remember that the 360 had huge competition that November: the Wii and PS3 launched.

You look at the history of November sales (NPD numbers), you see that the PS3 is selling poorly. And it has no more excuses.


Console sales this year equal 2,713,000. That is considerably higher than any other November total, going back to 2000. (Next highest = November 2001: a very special November: 2,303,868.)

[NEO-360]

This isn't a war, it's a slaughter! 360 is beatin' PS3 worse than Mayweather beat that kid Hatton.

Late summer Mochan, Whacko, Illy, Folken, Slade, Zilla all said after Bungie left, after EA bought Bioware, after the RROD, Microsoft was going to get out of the business, and that things had turned a corner for PS3. They couldn't have been more wrong, just like they've been wrong about this entire gen. MS has had a brilliant strategy from the beginning and I just wonder how uglier things would be for Sony without RROD?

I have a PS3 and the system is already dry after a month barely! R&C is horrible, Uncharted is a little shy of great, and that's it. I was in Blockbuster last night looking for a PS3 game and the only game left i'm interested in is RFOM and that was out! Once I play RFOM I guess i'll turn off my PS3 until MGS4 turns up. I did watch Reign Over Me on Blu-ray last night, so I guess it will be a movie player.

Nintendo and Wii, what can u say. Nintendo is definitely growing the base of gamers, really impressive numbers but equally weak software numbers. They are good for the industry and there is definitely room in the casual crowd. All I can say is thank goodness for variety, Nintendo figured there was a market out there for their vision and they were right, good job.

Hey if Sony can't sell 500,000 units over November with Black Friday, they are in trouble! If they don't have a game that can debut with 1 million sold, they are in trouble. Look at the COD4 numbers, 1.5 million on 360, is it really even necessary to do a PS3 version? How much better could the game had of been if they just focused on the 360, and do u think they are going to break even with whatever it cost them to make a PS3 version? I doubt it, but then again the game is so cheap when u think about it, it probably didn't cost much. Just spruce up the COD2 engine is all they did.

Surprised Mass Effect's numbers are so low. I can't wait to play the game, but I have to since it is on my XMAS list, it has been incredibly painful avoiding this game for so long.

Whats up VGR!?! Trust me TMG if you dont get it for X-mas buy Mass Effect. So far I can honestly say this is some of Bioware's finest work. The game kicks ass! When you do finally get it be prepared to be amazed.The beginning is kinda slow though. But once you get Spectre status and get your ship and crew thats when the fun begins.Thats all I'm gonna tell you. And when you get to the Galaxy Map aboard your ship its a little tricky to operate. Be patient.

After reading those numbers its painfully obvious now that not even cutting the PS3 by $100 bucks can save it now. Looking at the difference of sales with games like Assassin's Creed & COD4 that right there tells the story with software sales loud and clear. Did Sony actually think selling a cheaper PS3 with no access to PS2 games was going to make an impact? I dont think so.

You know its sad when the PS2 is outselling the PS3 in terms of hardware. I know the Milk drinkers club(Ilnadmy, Slade, Capt Sony 001,Whacko,Zilla,and Mochan) wont have much to say. Simply put:There is nothing they can say.The Wii & The 360 is kicking the PS3's ass. And the PS2 is helping it happen. I'm like you TMG i want more games. I want Assassin's Creed and COD4, but the Wife has banned me from buying any games until X-mas. Till then I'm still playing Raw vs. Smackdown and Mass Effect.I havent bought any Wii games in over a month. Oh well. Cant wait till 2008. Ninja Gaiden 2, Devil May Cry 4, GTA 4,etc; And believe it or not I'am geeked to see how MGS4 turns out too. :thumbsup:

[NEO-360]

Once the games lead on the PS3, it will perform better there. Capcom starts off on the PC and then ports it over to the consoles and move on from there. DMC4 however is a game built more to the tune of the PS3, it looks better on the PS3 and performs better there as well. There is no way anyone should be subjected to playing a DMC game on the xbox pad, trying switching weapons on the fly with xbox triggers and try the same on the dual shock 3/sixaxis. The PS3 controller is simply superior for the majority of genres out there and it's on equal footing on the rest. Try playing one of the two copies of VF5-360 out there, that's with the 360 dpad, there's simply no contest when it comes to the superior DPAD on the SIXAXIS/DS3, and that applies to the gorgeous looking SOUL CALIBUR4, TEKKEN6 and soon STREETFIGHTER 4.


Action games and fighters are always better played on the PS pad. Sigma controlled smoother imo and so will DMC4. In NG2, there's weapons switching says Itagaki, but it's gimped, because the game pauses, (not so real-time). DMC3 had realtime weapon switching, so does DMC4. A superior setup in terms of controls and hardware, will always win out if it's the main sku, the limitations of NG2 are already telling.


I'm a big Rygar fan, but Rygar Wii won't be as special as the first, it's simply a port where the main char has a blondish look and a clothing change, it looks worse than the PS2 version IMO.

You're truly acting like a 500 lb person with short arms trying to wipe their arse:Reaching real hard.:D If anyone has had a DC or the original Xbox then they know what to expect in terms of handling the controls for fighting games. Let us not forget which console had more fighting games online than the PS2 and currently the PS3.

Plus let us also not forget VF5 was offline for the PS3 and currently on Xbox live for the 360. I guess after getting biatch slapped with those lower than low NPD numbers for the PS3 this is truly the only thing left for you to do is crusade about the PS3 control being the best. LOL! Because those numbers we read definately tells the story on who is REALLY winning where it counts. Keep hope alive Lastword. Keep hope alive. :p If you are a PS3 owner or supporter you're gonna need it.

[Gamer From '78]

Once the games lead on the PS3, it will perform better there. Capcom starts off on the PC and then ports it over to the consoles and move on from there. DMC4 however is a game built more to the tune of the PS3, it looks better on the PS3 and performs better there as well. There is no way anyone should be subjected to playing a DMC game on the xbox pad, trying switching weapons on the fly with xbox triggers and try the same on the dual shock 3/sixaxis. The PS3 controller is simply superior for the majority of genres out there and it's on equal footing on the rest. Try playing one of the two copies of VF5-360 out there, that's with the 360 dpad, there's simply no contest when it comes to the superior DPAD on the SIXAXIS/DS3, and that applies to the gorgeous looking SOUL CALIBUR4, TEKKEN6 and soon STREETFIGHTER 4.


Action games and fighters are always better played on the PS pad. Sigma controlled smoother imo and so will DMC4. In NG2, there's weapons switching says Itagaki, but it's gimped, because the game pauses, (not so real-time). DMC3 had realtime weapon switching, so does DMC4. A superior setup in terms of controls and hardware, will always win out if it's the main sku, the limitations of NG2 are already telling.


I'm a big Rygar fan, but Rygar Wii won't be as special as the first, it's simply a port where the main char has a blondish look and a clothing change, it looks worse than the PS2 version IMO.

Preference of controls is tailored to each individual, but the 360 controller is WIDELY regarded as superior to the PS3 Sixassis.

FPS play much better on the 360 controller. The stick layout as well as the indented tops are superior. Racers control superior because of the analog triggers.

The only flaw with the 360 controller is the D-pad isn't as responsive as people think it should be. But playing games like Devil May Cry, you are stretching and grasping for straws to say it will play worse on the 360. If all you have to do is click a trigger to change weapons, how is the 360 controller going to be any worse than the Sixassis? Clicking through things with the D-pad on the 360 controller is simple and problem-free.

If anything, 360 versions of multiplats will continue to be superior as they have been since the day the PS3 launched.

Now onto DMC4...how does it look better on the PS3? Show me proof. Show me ANYTHING that claims this. Same for Street Fighter IV, Soul Calibur IV and others. Tekken will of course look better on PS3 because it is exclusive. But it won't touch the graphics of DOA4. Mark my words. :D

[slade]

Now onto DMC4...how does it look better on the PS3?

It's funny that you don't know this considering all the BS you pull with multiplat comparisons. Funny, but expected.

Anyway, the last 1up podcast mentioned tearing and framerate dips in the 360 version of DMC4 as opposed to the PS3 version which ran much smoother. Some other place also mentioned that the graphics on the PS3 version are slightly better although this last comment I attribute to contrast settings. The way the PS3 outputs the image, to me, appears a lot better then the darker image the 360 outputs.

Over on IGN though, an interview with the producer stated that there isn't any difference between both titles and that graphically, the only difference will come down to the contrast settings between both systems. As of the actual build shown off to the press though, which is also probably the demo we are getting next month, this isn't ringing true.

[PapaSmurf]

This is an interesting thread.

I agree with G78 that placement on 360 controllers is better for the FPS genre, but it's not a deal breaker. The only thing about this arguement is that any FPS that comes out on the both 360 and PS3 is also going to be on the PC, which is where a lot of us PS3 guys play FPS (COD4, Gear of War, Orange Box). So this is a mute point for half of us, and we win in the end if there is an exlcusive FPS for PS3 (Haze, Killzone 2, though they could turn out to be duds...)

As for these sales, I tend to think the 360 has underachieved. People tend to forget that the PS3 is selling as much as the 360 was when it came out at this point, but the 360 didn't even have competition, while the PS3 has had to compete with the Wii and 360. Clearly the PS3 is in last, but with this format war still becoming more and more in blu's favor even with the Paramount move, there's still a good chance Sony's gamble could pay off.

There's really nothing out of the ordinary here. The 360 had better games this year like Halo 3(which I don't agree with but hey), Mass Effect, and BioShock. It didn't help that some of the PS3's best games were multiplats like Assasin's Creed and Call of Duty 4. Warhawk, Uncharted are must have games for PS3 owners (Warhawk for users with internet of course), but they really aren't on Mass Effect or Halo 3 caliber, but to each his own. I still think verdict is out on Ratchet and Clank, because however fun it may be it doesn't seem all that appealing.

Again though, no one said Sony would win this year. If they lose next year, then there might be some issues. From the outlook Sony should have the better exclusives next year (MGS4, FF13, GT5, KZ2) along with some multiplats coming on over that were timed ex (Ace Combat 6, Lost Planet) and will be on par with multiplats. If Sony does bad next year, I might say defeat, but to declare them losers when they haven't even released their big guns is truly premature.

[thelastword]

Preference of controls is tailored to each individual, but the 360 controller is WIDELY regarded as superior to the PS3 Sixassis.

FPS play much better on the 360 controller. The stick layout as well as the indented tops are superior. Racers control superior because of the analog triggers. WIDELY considered better, amongst xbots perhaps, but that isn't saying much now does it? Thing is, last gen I'd give the xbox controller the medal for this genre, certainly not this gen, I think it's a very competent controller for the genre though, very smooth, but the best controlling fps's atm goes to RFOM and UT3 (without a doubt), yeah! EPIC did that good of a job, some folk are even giving it to UT3 overall just edging RFOM. I know folk who's laying waste to folk playing with Mouse & Keyboard on the PS3, it's that damn good, really.

Let's not forget about COD4 on the PS3, plays like a dream and the controls definitely feels a bit better over the xbox controller in multiplayer. Let's not forget all these Youtube videos of PS3 owners establishing 10-11 second scores in the speed run at the beginning of COD, you can't deny what's in your face, I'm sure many PC guys have not been able to muster such results, last gen the dualshock 2 was worse for fps, certainly not this gen.



The only flaw with the 360 controller is the D-pad isn't as responsive as people think it should be. But playing games like Devil May Cry, you are stretching and grasping for straws to say it will play worse on the 360. If all you have to do is click a trigger to change weapons, how is the 360 controller going to be any worse than the Sixassis? Clicking through things with the D-pad on the 360 controller is simple and problem-free. Obviously, you don't know how deep the combat in DMC3/4 is and will be. These triggers are an abomination for such fast paced action, DMC is certainly not a take my time, whilst I dial-me-up a combo for massive damage game, it's certainly not about paused menus for weapon switching. These indented triggers maybe good for slow style fps like Halo, but certainly not for fast paced 60fps gameplay. In NG all you had to do was take your time and dial up Izuna drop or demoralize the enemies with an unending wave of flying swallow, that doesn't take much effort, neither does it require a superior design controller like the dualshock, these are basically, a dial-up combo move and a simple aerial slash move that rewarded you tonnes in that game.


If anything, 360 versions of multiplats will continue to be superior as they have been since the day the PS3 launched.

Now onto DMC4...how does it look better on the PS3? Show me proof. Show me ANYTHING that claims this. Same for Street Fighter IV, Soul Calibur IV and others. Tekken will of course look better on PS3 because it is exclusive. But it won't touch the graphics of DOA4. Mark my words. :D
Well I know of several superior multi's on the PS3, I'm sure that you do as well. The thing is, alot of development is going to shift to the PS3 as the lead sku, in the wake of Sega Rally Revo and Burnout. These are the best representations of solid multiplats atm, where the PS3 version is not gimped because they're attempting to port from 360. That is the whole point of devving on the more complicated/superior hardware, hell even the 360 version becomes better for it.

People will watch at burnout and see what a lead sku suppose to represent, massive city, no load times between it, crazy physics, 720p, this is a next gen engine, it's certainly not COD4 propped up from the COD2 engine at 600p. The 360 port is also very similar in terms of IQ, barring the framerate dips and the lower crash physics, it's actually a better game as a result even then. If it was the other way around, we would simply have a less ambitious burnout.

As for SC4 and SF, I didnt say they look better on PS3, at least not yet, haven't seen them running yet. If you want to know where I got the info on DMC4, check out 1up's preview on last week's "the1upshow".

[DrunkenThumbmaster]

I own a PS3 I own Call of Duty 4 for the PS3. You are out of your freaking mind dude. The placement of the analogue sticks are horrible the responsiveness aren't the level of the 360 there still as loose as they were with the dual shock 3. The triggers are horrble as well on the PS3.

I''ve played Burnout on Both systems (Demos) and you are Full of Sh!t the only difference is the coloring looks brighter and there fore a bit more cartoony on the 360 this could be contributed to the contrast setting though. But for a game built up for the PS3 and ported to the X360 the difference isn't telling at all.

And I"ve played them both and I doubt you even own a PS3 if so what's your PSN ID???? I know you don't have to prove yourself to me though.

[Glockstar]

As for these sales, I tend to think the 360 has underachieved. People tend to forget that the PS3 is selling as much as the 360 was when it came out at this point, but the 360 didn't even have competition, while the PS3 has had to compete with the Wii and 360.

360 sales from Jan. - Nov., 2006 (Nov. on top, Jan. on bottom)
511,000
218,000
259,458
206,000
207,000
277,000
220,877
295,381
192,000
161,000
249,000
-----------
2,796,716

PS3 sales from Jan. - Nov. 2007 (again, same setup)
466,000
121,000
119,000
130,600
159,000
98,500
81,000
82,000
130,000
127,000
243,554
--------------
1,757,654

The PS3 is over a million total units behind where the 360 was at the same point in it's lifecycle. And as you can see, it has never matched what the 360 has done on a monthly basis - maybe but only once.

But oh yeah, as a Blu-ray player it's a top seller. *Fap fap fap* :rolleyes:

[silversparrow]

One thing you've got to remember Glockstar is that the PS3 hasn't been out for a year everywhere in the world yet. It was launched in PAL regions in March of this year. In contrast the 360 launched in each region within a month's time. You have to keep that in mind when comparing the first year sales of each console.

[slade]

He's only comparing the NPD numbers though.
Even if Sony loses the war completely in N. America, worldwide, they may catch up.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Don't count your chickens yet our predictions were for a turnaround in 2008, as your selective memory fails to register.



It's a crap game from Bioware, what do you expect? Then again, "crap" games like Call of Duty 4 can sell 1.5 million so maybe Mass Effect just got unlucky. Or as Neo would put it, it just "wasn't as popular."

I'm not really counting "my chickens" I own a PS3, so in my own best interest I hope both companies slug the sh*t out of each other with stellar hits. I hope it is a knock-down drag out AAA title slug-fest. But right now, it just doesn't look like PS3 can keep up the pace. One or two big games around XMAS, the old PS2 formula, just isnt going to suffice when 360 can pump out hits monthly!

As far as a turn-around for '08, that really starts in Nov-Dec, if they haven't done crap in Nov - Dec, they are going to get off to a slow start. The price drop, Uncharted, R&C, UT3, all were timed to have an impact this holiday shopping season.

Yeah Bioware crap game, whatever, your track record on what is good and bad is well known. Keep your 5 hour superficial graphic showcase games, M.E. is worth 20 COD4s, even with the glitches. Funny thing about the glitches though, KOTOR had a lot of glitches, but I never had problems with the games. So I read about the glitches with a grain 'o salt. Its funny because all of these problems associated with 360, some how don't affect my system. Guess mine was made by Billy boy himself, special, just for me.

[ilnadmy]

M.E. is worth 20 COD4s, even with the glitches.

Saaaaay whaaaaat? I've been playing COD4 online solidly since I got it a few weeks back, not to mention replaying the campaign and the various missions, each of which is really interesting. Now I haven't played ME, but then again neither have you, so let's not get into comparing games we haven't played, shall we?

[thelastword]

I own a PS3 I own Call of Duty 4 for the PS3. You are out of your freaking mind dude. The placement of the analogue sticks are horrible the responsiveness aren't the level of the 360 there still as loose as they were with the dual shock 3. The triggers are horrble as well on the PS3.
You mean the Dual Shock 3 that has only been available recently, and of course only in Japan, you are saying you used it in the PS2 era? Still slippery huh! I always told you man, you seem to have all these good connections, you keep testing all these products years before they're even available..anyways inform us some more.:rolleyes:


Dude, if you are the light of VGR, then there's no way light is right, hook me up on some darkness and void pronto. In any case, I think the 360 controller is good for shooters, but it's not better than the sixaxis. I can say they're on even keel, but for faster paced shooters, the sixaxis/dualshock3 is superior. I've even touched on racers, and how the PS3 analogue sticks have more range when it comes to controlling your vehicles.

One thing is certain though, and no matter how much some folk want to deny it's worth, is sixaxis Motion Control in games, even in burnout there is MC support, you can control your vehicles in PARADISE just as you could in mstorm, I think it's a touch tighter since B4 runs at a rocking 60 and you don't have to toss as much, but results are what they are, and 10-11fps in the COD4 speedtest is all the convincing you need, if you need more, plug in mouse and keyboard in PS3 UT3 and think for a minute that you won't get demolished by a sixaxis user.

[Mochan]

. So I read about the glitches with a grain 'o salt. Its funny because all of these problems associated with 360, some how don't affect my system. Guess mine was made by Billy boy himself, special, just for me.

It just means your tolerance for crap is very well-developed. i.e. you're being shovelled crap and you don't even know it. Luck you, how envious. You couldn't spot a glitch if it bit you in the ass.

[silversparrow]

plug in mouse and keyboard in PS3 UT3 and think for a minute that you won't get demolished by a sixaxis user.

Nuh-uh, no way. The Sixaxis does not stand up to a KB/M let alone beat it for FPS. Not by a long shot.

There's a reason Epic included "KB/M free" matches in UT3 for Sixaxis users.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Saaaaay whaaaaat? I've been playing COD4 online solidly since I got it a few weeks back, not to mention replaying the campaign and the various missions, each of which is really interesting. Now I haven't played ME, but then again neither have you, so let's not get into comparing games we haven't played, shall we?

Well, I do have a little history with Bioware games, I think I know what to expect. But what I meant by saying it is worth 20 COD4s, I was talking about the gameplay value of the single player campaign. There is way more gameplay in M.E. than COD4, but I can appreciate u like the multiplayer.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

It just means your tolerance for crap is very well-developed. i.e. you're being shovelled crap and you don't even know it. Luck you, how envious. You couldn't spot a glitch if it bit you in the ass.

No it just means exactly what I said, I haven't ran into these problems. My 360 doesn't glitch up or lock up, though my PS3 does if there is one spec on a disc, and Tashi and someone else ran into the same problem with Conan on the PS3. People here have had problems with Assassin's Creed on PS3. People had problems with Bioshock on the PC, and who knows what kinda hell u gotta put up with to play Crysis and UT3 on the PC effin around with settings to get a framerate faster than a slide show. But when I played J.E. I never had a glitch with the game. When I played KOTOR I never ran into this one particular glitch that like sunk everyone, actually there were two glitches. One had to do with the one funky looking chick getting killed or not a member of your party when you got to a certain point, it just so happened that when I did that portion of the game, she was in my party. And the other big glitch was the end of the game, something about killing the wookie or not killing him caused a glitched, whatever it was, I did the opposite and never ran into that glitch. Anyway I acknowledge those were legit probs with the developer though.

[ilnadmy]

Haha tlw thinks Sixaxis users can kill KB/M users. I'd love to see that match-up to be honest.

[thelastword]

Nuh-uh, no way. The Sixaxis does not stand up to a KB/M let alone beat it for FPS. Not by a long shot.

There's a reason Epic included "KB/M free" matches in UT3 for Sixaxis users.I didn't say it was better for fps over M&K, only said that sixaxis users are taking out M&K players no problem. It's certainly not a case where once you plug in a mouse and keyboard, that you are by default a UT god. There are really good M&K players, but there are also ace sixaxis users in kind, it's all about how proficient you really are, there's simply no default champion based on the controls used, you've got to step in and prove your metal, K&M or Sixaxis.

[DrunkenThumbmaster]

you're a freaking idiot. You must be talking about the best Sixaxis player in the world against the worst M&K player in the world.

The simple fact is that your wrist will give you more control and precision anyday that your thumbs will. Ergo the M&K is more precise than the six axis. Oh and I mistyped earlier and you knew it but you didn't have a legitamate point so you harp on that. classic!

[thelastword]

Hey! Jokio, why don't you indicate where I said the sixaxis was superior over the mouse and keyboard for fp shooters.....This whole debate was about the sixaxis against the 360 controller. I said the best controlling fp shooters on consoles were UT3 and RFOM.

Here is a game though where K&M players can mix in the fray with sixaxis users. I'm saying, the controls are so good that fragging K&M players is not
impossible from what I've seen, pressing on the point of how good the DS3 is for shooters in this generation, you seem to miss points quite a bit, but I understand....Oh! dangit, you also mistype quite a bit too. You mean you weren't playing with the DS3, when all we had were DS2's? WHOWOULDAFUNKIT....carry on though.

[theWacoKid]

Well, I do have a little history with Bioware games, I think I know what to expect. But what I meant by saying it is worth 20 COD4s, I was talking about the gameplay value of the single player campaign. There is way more gameplay in M.E. than COD4, but I can appreciate u like the multiplayer.

Translation, you haven't played ME, you're talking out your ass once again, because guess what genius, ME is a short game, it can be completed in under 20 hours, making your entire 20 COD4 claims utter nonsense, which is typical of your postings. There is no 100 hours o gameplay to be found in ME.

[DrunkenThumbmaster]

Hey! Jokio, why don't you indicate where I said the sixaxis was superior over the mouse and keyboard for fp shooters.....This whole debate was about the sixaxis against the 360 controller. I said the best controlling fp shooters on consoles were UT3 and RFOM.

Here is a game though where K&M players can mix in the fray with sixaxis users. I'm saying, the controls are so good that fragging K&M players is not
impossible from what I've seen, pressing on the point of how good the DS3 is for shooters in this generation, you seem to miss points quite a bit, but I understand....Oh! dangit, you also mistype quite a bit too. You mean you weren't playing with the DS3, when all we had were DS2's? WHOWOULDAFUNKIT....carry on though.


RFOM and UT3 are the best controlling FPS's on consoles where the fvck do you come up with this shti, Resistance still has that stupid A$$ weapon select system carried over from the Ratchet games.

It's pretty much accepted fact that the six axis is garbage 96.73% of the motion control in games are garbage. The sticks aren't offset so your fingers don't fall naturally on them the sticks are too loose so it's harder to make precise movements. And the tops are concave unlike the 360 pad making it easier to slip your thumbs off. You're an idiot.

[Cuddly Knife]

Halo 3 controls wayyy better than Fall of Man. Like Thumbmaster said, the position fo the sticks isn't as comfortable on the hands as the 360 controller. Sure, it works just peachy when you only have to use one stick, but when talking about using both, 360 baby. Also, I agree with him on the whole convex vs concave(except he has it opposite, but we all know what he means.) thing. I constantly have to adjust my thumbs whenever I play games like SSHD, where you always have to have your thumbs on the sticks. Placing your thumbs slightly under kind of fixes the issue, but that also lessens you precision.

Don't forget, word, that the PS3 version of UT3 has also been slowed down compared to the PS3 version, obviously to give the people who use controllers more of a level playing field.

[ilnadmy]

I don't get this whole "the sixaxis sticks aren't offset so it's harder to place your fingers on". Newflash, both your hands look exactly the same, just mirrored. That means that both of your thumbs are (hopefully) located on the exact same position on each hand. Why would you say having a lower right analog stick and a higher left analog stick is more comfortable than having both analog sticks in the same position? Are you people mad? Or am I the only one with normal thumbs around here?

I will admit that the convex analog sticks do cause some slippage though.

[Jaa Phaanom]

I don't get this whole "the sixaxis sticks aren't offset so it's harder to place your fingers on". Newflash, both your hands look exactly the same, just mirrored. That means that both of your thumbs are (hopefully) located on the exact same position on each hand. Why would you say having a lower right analog stick and a higher left analog stick is more comfortable than having both analog sticks in the same position? Are you people mad? Or am I the only one with normal thumbs around here?

.

Because your right thumb is usually pressing buttons and not on the analog stick.

[ilnadmy]

I was talking about FPS games actually.

[NEO-360]

He's only comparing the NPD numbers though.
Even if Sony loses the war completely in N. America, worldwide, they may catch up.

After looking at the NPD numbers for November I cant help but laugh at what you just posted. I mean lets keep it real here Metal Gear,GT,and Final Fantasy are the big 3 that may jumpstart the PS3 for 2008 and then again they may not. I mean how in the blue hell can you compare COD4 selling over 400,000 plus for the PS3 to the 360 selling 1.57 million of the same game? If that is a preview of things to come Sony has a ---tload of catching up to do come next year.:)

[thelastword]

RFOM and UT3 are the best controlling FPS's on consoles where the fvck do you come up with this shti, Resistance still has that stupid A$$ weapon select system carried over from the Ratchet games.

What weapon selection system? choosing a weapon in RFOM is a quick snap on the sixaxis trigger, is that really too much for you? or do you prefer to be babysitted through it like in Halo. "PRESS X TO CHANGE WEAPON", dude get done. RFOM''s arsenal of weapons is way superior to HALO's and triggering through the horde of weapons available defines smooth weapon selection, you are drunk if you have the audacity to mention HALO in this scenario, but you've always been leagues shy of any type of an informed opinion, so nothing surprising here.


It's pretty much accepted fact that the six axis is garbage 96.73% of the motion control in games are garbage. The sticks aren't offset so your fingers don't fall naturally on them the sticks are too loose so it's harder to make precise movements. And the tops are concave unlike the 360 pad making it easier to slip your thumbs off. You're an idiot.Flow, Folklore and Go Sports Ski controls brilliantly via MC, and there's so many other examples, but you're just doing what you do best, springing useless and ignorant vomit bits.

In any case, what exactly do you mean by "your fingers don't fall naturally on them", do you know that the whlole point of a stick is to steer it via any direction as quickly and comfortably as possible, doing all that with a great range of motion? Do you know that trying to indent your finger into a concave groove can only inhibit stick movement. Resting your thumb on a stick is superior to resting your thumb into one, your thumb is your most powerful finger, it doesn't need to be supported by a groove, the prior option actually allows you the choice of resting your thumbs on the apex of the convex, below it or over, even more options for comfort based on the gamer's comfort zone, I hope you get it.

Simply speaking, the sixaxis already has a has a higher range of motion over the 360 controller, at least 1/2 a cm in any given direction, dodging and cornering are definitely examples where the higher range of motion helps, any further inhibitions of having a slightly bent finger into a concave groove is only going deter stick movement, no matter how slight.

As I've said, for slow fps like Halo, the 360 controller may be cool, but for quicker fps like RFOM and UT3 the sixaxis will always prove better. And please tell me, how gamers were able to pull 10-11 seconds on the COD4 speed test, which rewards speed and accuracy, ON THE PS3.

[thelastword]

Also, I agree with him on the whole convex vs concave(except he has it opposite, but we all know what he means.)
Should I know what he meant? really? Knife, this guy is always so wrong, I mean ALWAYS....


Don't forget, word, that the PS3 version of UT3 has also been slowed down compared to the PS3 version, obviously to give the people who use controllers more of a level playing field.You mean the PC version over the PS3 version, not the PS3 over the PS3, in your case I can understand what you meant, in Drunk's case though, mannnnnnnnnnn, you never know, you just don't..

The game was slowed down on the PS3 to better accomodate gamepad controls, but it's still faster than the fastest fps on consoles prior to, (that's RFOM). In any case, I think people actually love the slightly slower pace over the PC version, it's really top notch and with K&M in, everybody can groove. So if you've been following, you'll also realize that the PS3 community in UT3 is actually superior to that of PC, crazy times huh!.

[Cuddly Knife]

D'OH! I made the same kind of mistake. Yeah, I meant they slowed the PS3 version down from what the pc is at. But that's also part of nmy argument. That the controlelr users might not be able to roll with the kb/mouse users if it was at its normal pc pace.

I'm happy that the console version is kicking ass over the pc version. I know I'll be buying the game when they update it to support the mods and stuff. The map editor in Far Cry 360 gave the game a ton of legs for me, and this one will be even moreso because they have that, plus bots, for when I want to shred my cousins, friends, and nephews/nieces.

[Dancer O_o]

One thing I really hate about FPS controls on controllers is that almost all have the crouch on one of the sticks. I have died a crappy death umpteen times because of trying to run only to discover in your panic the crouch must have been pressed, you are now crouched and inching away from the battlefield at a literal crawl while taking damage...it's one of those controller throwing kinda pissed I get.

[Glockstar]

Haw... you got spazzy thumbs, like me.

[ilnadmy]

LOL @ console peeps trying to play FPS.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

Translation, you haven't played ME, you're talking out your ass once again, because guess what genius, ME is a short game, it can be completed in under 20 hours, making your entire 20 COD4 claims utter nonsense, which is typical of your postings. There is no 100 hours o gameplay to be found in ME.

That 20 is probably not completing all of the quest, its probably on one of the easier settings if you can change the difficulty. Plus I finished COD4 in well under 10 hours, it would have been 6-7 hours had I not got snagged up on that one stupid timed mission to disable the nukes, and this was on VET mode. So on normal I woulda finished that game in 5 hours easy. So maybe there is no 100 hours gameplay, but there is NO replay value in COD4. I'm sure in M.E. there are a bunch of different ways to handle situations, different combinations of members you can have in your party etc.

[Glockstar]

LOL @ console peeps trying to play FPS.

Whatever. :rolleyes:

You want to see something funny, watch me try to play a fast-action game with the keyboard.

[ilnadmy]

I never said KB/M is the best control system for all types of games. Action games, racing games, fighting games all play better with a controller. But shooters? GTFO, that's PC territory.

[ThaMaskedGamer]

I never said KB/M is the best control system for all types of games. Action games, racing games, fighting games all play better with a controller. But shooters? GTFO, that's PC territory.

Word processing is the KYB/M territory, so go type a guy to death. I'd rather aim and pull than type and click. Seriously though, moving a mouse cursor over a target and clicking is lame, i'm not going to deny it is fast and efficient, but it definitely isn't satisfying. And I don't how you get rumble from a KYB/M but games just aren't the same without rumble, when I play PS3 and then go back to 360, that's the first damn thing I notice. I'm actually thinking about NOT playing RFOM until the new controllers arrive and a rumble patch is released for the game.

[Glockstar]

Maybe for the aiming. But you know there's more to a shooter nowadays than just aiming and pulling the trigger. You've got to move; you've got to strafe; you've got to get from point A to point B.

I never specifically said that the mouse sucked. Just the keyboard. But since the mouse is usually lumped in with the keyboard when it comes to controller configurations and descriptions then yeah, I say it sucks too. Because the keyboard is that bad.

[Glockstar]

And I don't how you get rumble from a KYB/M but games just aren't the same without rumble...

Oh keyboards give you tactile feedback: *click* *click* *click*

[ilnadmy]

Rumble? Who needs rumble? You want rumble go shoot a real gun.

And the keyboard is efficient as hell for movement. With COD4 online, without moving my left hand I can access the movement keys, the sprint key, the crouch key, the prone key, the grenade key, the smoke grenade key, the melee key, the use key, the jump key, not to mention INSTANT switching to whichever weapon I want, rather than using some lame method of cycling through all your weapons. You know why Halo instituted the 2 weapons only system? Because the controller is LIMITED in not allowing you to switch your weapons on the fly. You want to talk about lack of multitasking, what really pisses me off when playing console FPS is that I can't f***ing aim if I decide to melee or jump or reload, because I have to take my thumb off the right analog stick to use those buttons. No need for that loss of control on the PC. You need to jump and aim while you're in the air? No problem. You want to run up to a doorway, make a quick 90 degree turn and melee someone in the back? No problem. With a controller though? Yeah good luck.

[silversparrow]

Maybe for the aiming. But you know there's more to a shooter nowadays than just aiming and pulling the trigger. You've got to move; you've got to strafe; you've got to get from point A to point B.

Yes, and with a KB/M you strafe using the WASD keys, except you can change directions faster than with an analog stick.

I never specifically said that the mouse sucked. Just the keyboard. But since the mouse is usually lumped in with the keyboard when it comes to controller configurations and descriptions then yeah, I say it sucks too. Because the keyboard is that bad.

No, the keyboard is vastly superior. Here's just a couple of reasons why:

-In FPS where you can carry more than two weapons, like Orange Box, you can instantly switch to whatever weapon you want with the number keys. No cyclic menu here.
-When sniping, you can crouch, strafe and fire at the same time more easily. With a controller it's pretty awkward having to hold down one shoulder button while moving both analog sticks.
-You can quick load/save with the press of a key. Extremely useful in difficult areas that need frequent reloading.

[silversparrow]

Word processing is the KYB/M territory, so go type a guy to death. I'd rather aim and pull than type and click. Seriously though, moving a mouse cursor over a target and clicking is lame, i'm not going to deny it is fast and efficient, but it definitely isn't satisfying.

IMO, it's much less satisfying pulling the trigger on a console FPS knowing that compared to the PC version enemy movements are slowed down and the blast radius of the weapons are larger. These handicaps are due to the imprecision of aiming with your thumb.

[Gadfly2317]

Yet another Kb/m vs thumbstick and buttons. . . I've just gotta add: the Wii controller is better than either; whether as fast as KB/m, its MUCH faster than thumbsticks, and it is vastly more realistic of a shooting mechanic, the other two ways don't resemble shooting a gun at all; Wii does.

[silversparrow]

Yet another Kb/m vs thumbstick and buttons. . .

Yeah, these arguments are a beotch... :mad2:

I should point out that I don't think think controllers are bad for FPS. I can respect someone's decision to stick with consoles. Gaming on PCs can be an expensive endeavor. It's not for everybody.

But when somebody says controllers are better than a KB/M for FPS, I feel inclined to step in and refute that argument. Some people throw around some pretty broken logic analogous to "My Dodge Neon can corner better than a Porsche 911 because it's more challenging to do so and you get better satisfaction in the end!" Just don't go there folks. :)

As for the Wiimote, yeah I agree it's the most realistic control scheme for FPS so far. Not as fast or precise as KB/M, but more realistic nonetheless, and better than traditional controllers.

[Glockstar]

Yes, and with a KB/M you strafe using the WASD keys, except you can change directions faster than with an analog stick.

Maybe you can. But not only do I find the experience of playing with my fingertips to be awkward and uncomfortable, but every time I look down at the keyboard and away from the monitor I feel this... oh, I don't know... disconnect... from the game I'm playing. :p

[Mochan]

moving a mouse cursor over a target and clicking is lame,


It seems you don't understand how using a mouse works. You don't move a cursor around the screen, you ignoramus. The only FPS game I can think of where you actually moved a cursor around on the screen is Operation Flashpoint and it was only partially. Mouse Look is different from moving a cursor over a target.

[Dancer O_o]

I've just gotta add: the Wii controller is better than either; whether as fast as KB/m, its MUCH faster than thumbsticks, and it is vastly more realistic of a shooting mechanic, the other two ways don't resemble shooting a gun at all; Wii does.

Yep, when I shoot in Metroid it feels exacly the same as when I shot the cat with a pellet gun, exactly the same.

[Mochan]

Wiimoto for shooting is the main reason why I'm even interested in the Wii. As good as the game probably is, I'm not exactly rearing to buy a Wii to play Super Mario Galaxy.

[Dancer O_o]

Wiimoto for shooting is the main reason why I'm even interested in the Wii. As good as the game probably is, I'm not exactly rearing to buy a Wii to play Super Mario Galaxy.

It'll probably get GOTY though, or that Monster Hunter stuff. I beat Mass Effect last night, 18.5 hours for the main quest with only one or two mind-numbingly boring side quests. The game is greater than the sum of its faults....but not by much, it's Bioware's weakest effect next to Jade Empire (that game was good but the story was meh).

[Cuddly Knife]

Yep, when I shoot in Metroid it feels exacly the same as when I shot the cat with a pellet gun, exactly the same.
What a dick. I hope you get shot with something that is equal in pain to a cat getting shot with a pellet gun.

[Dancer O_o]

What a dick. I hope you get shot with something that is equal in pain to a cat getting shot with a pellet gun.

You thought I was serious? Get a grip...