IGN's Top 100 Games of All Time

[Glockstar]

(Hey, remember our VGR Top 50 that we did a few months ago? :wink5: )

http://top100.ign.com/2007/

But I warn you, you're not going to like it.

- World of Warcraft was 83?!

- GoldenEye 007 was 75?!

- They got Tecmo Bowl on there (#70) instead of Tecmo Super Bowl?!

- Super Mario Bros. 3 was 39?!

- Halo was 32?!

- SimCity 2000 was 25?!

- Doom was 19?!

- But fracking Half-Life 2 was #6?! What a joke.

GoldenEye, SMB3, Halo, SimCity 2000, and Doom are widely regarded as Top 10 All-Time games. Even if you didn't like them personally, you knew 10 people that did. These games were HUGE. These games were important.

And WOW... that should be a contender for #1 All-Time. EVERYBODY plays it. You talk to some guy who doesn't even play videogames, and he'll tell you that he's got a serious WOW addiction. The game's still a juggernaut - at three years of age! 83... pffffft. :rolleyes:

[T.Tashi]

The #1 game doesn't say much for gaming over the last 22 years. But if you wanna rate nostaglia then I guess it fits.

[ilnadmy]

You bring up a good point about WoW, Glock. I think with these lists, the sites are afraid to rate newly released games too highly. Of course, they've got that piece of sh** Half Life 2 up at #6, which is a freaking joke and a half, but yeah WoW should definitely be higher on the list. MUCH higher. It brought MMORPGs to the mainstream crowd. It did what the Wii is currently doing before the Wii was even a twinkle in Miyamoto's eye.

[Mochan]

Most sites don't like to rate new games highly. I think they're afraid it makes them look like newbies. Frankly though many old games for me aren't worth making a Top 100. Many old games I wouldn't put above a new game any day of the week. Some, like the truly transcendent ones that had gameplay or otherwise did something you don't see these days (like Star Control 2) I am totally willing to lop into the equation, but something like Doom? It's been redefined and improved upon so many times that I don't feel like giving it any recognition except in a history lesson.

I guess it depends on what you mean by Top 100 -- are you looking at the kind of historical impact a game had, or are you looking at it in terms of how much you enjoyed the game? Since IGN admits that this is just their personal taste, I can't even imagine how bad their taste is. And since that taste "changes" according to them -- I think it's quite clear they weren't voting on some kind of historical impact perspective here unless they replayed all those old games they listed.

But no matter how you look at it Half Life 2 making it their is nuts.

[Glockstar]

You bring up a good point about WoW, Glock. I think with these lists, the sites are afraid to rate newly released games too highly. Of course, they've got that piece of sh** Half Life 2 up at #6, which is a freaking joke and a half, but yeah WoW should definitely be higher on the list. MUCH higher. It brought MMORPGs to the mainstream crowd. It did what the Wii is currently doing before the Wii was even a twinkle in Miyamoto's eye.

Most sites don't like to rate new games highly. I think they're afraid it makes them look like newbies.

- Guitar Hero II ... #49
- God of War ... #47
- Shadow of the Colossus ... #16
- Resident Evil 4 ... #10

And the reason why I cite these games: they all came out after WOW.

[ilnadmy]

Hmm...that's weeeeeeird.

Oh, and RE4 is not a top 10 game, I don't care how fun it is.

[folken001]

Nor is Halo. Personally, generic FPS wanna be should probably get left out the top 100, imo. I can see why RE4 list high. Halo @ 47? That's just retarded.

I think the logic behind this list is that.... games like FF7 had the strongest impact on players who played it when it first came out. For people who have already exposed to the newer games, they don't get impressed easily with the old classic games. I thought Xenogear was one of the best RPGs of all time, my friend who didn't play it until years after its release couldn't even play for more than 1 hr due to its outdated graphics. So we would think it's outrageous for some of the games not making it higher on the list but the reality is that this list is for everyone, new or old.

p.s I am not joking about Halo. I can't believe Glock actually wants it to get higher. That'd be the joke of THIS century.

p.s.s I think it's hard to rank MMORPGs because most of the people who play them for a long A$$ time aren't in for the fun gameplay. It's all about the in-game status and e-cock. despite some of the players having the IQ of 10, MMORPG is kind of the game that you can be anybody as long as you put countless hours in it. The fact that players can abandon their real life and be so much more successful in game is what makes the game so addicting. Is WoW really that good of a game? I played it and I disagree.

[silversparrow]

That list reads more like the "The Most Influential 100 Games of All Time" rather than the "The Top 100 Games of All Time". If that was the case, then I'd agree with ranking Super Mario Bro. and Tetris at the top. However, Doom should definitely be in the top 5 as that game had massive influence on the industry. Look at how many FPS games have been released since then.

[Mochan]

Yup. I agree with silversparrow, it's either "best games of all time" or "most influential games of all time" -- this list is a bit confused as to which one it is. Doom should definitely be way up there ... it created the market for the FPS crowd that is being milked to death today, and it also introduced the revolutionary concept of shareware which had a huge impact on the games industry in the 90s and is still done today by some companies like the massively successful PopCap. If you can give Mario the #1 spot I can't see why Doom isn't right up there with it.

[Cuddly Knife]

Here's our Top 50.

http://forums.videogamereview.com/showthread.php?t=9616

[ceevee]

not a bad list - if you're into nostalgia in a big way. Halo 3 not making it is a good thing.. is it revolutionary or added anything to the genre? problem is the same is said of Halo and that made it.. meh

at least there's a few more names i could add to flesh out next years VGR Top 50 Games of all time

[Tappy_Tibbons]

Half Life 2 is right where it belongs. This is missing GTA San Andreas.

[ceevee]

this list is illegal. i came across Planescape: Torment placed 71st, Deus Ex 34th, Fallout 33rd

notable absentees: Thief: (that first one that i can't remember d'oh!), No One Lives Forever (1 or 2), Commandos: Behind Enemy Lines, Civ IV (yes yes Civ 2 is there and civ 1 should be too), Rise of Nations, and unforgivably inexplicably Medieval: Total War. WTF?!?

this list is sh!t

[ilnadmy]

I agree ceevee. Any list without NOLF is a crappy-ass list.

NOLF = win.

[Mochan]

I honestly haven't gone through the entire 100 list, but not having Thief in there is a joke. Just like Doom created FPS games today as we know it Thief created Stealth Shooters.

ceevee, the only reason Halo 3 is not on the list is because they didn't put any game past 2006 (why, I don't know --- so a game can't be good if it only came out in the past year? Bonkers)

[Tappy_Tibbons]

No other FPS is better than Half Life 2

[GameLegend]

The #1 game doesn't say much for gaming over the last 22 years. But if you wanna rate nostaglia then I guess it fits.

Oh common.
The list may raise some eyebrows, but make no mistake that Super Mario Bros is the best game of all time; period.
No other game has revolutionized the gaming industry as it has.
No other game has a familiar ring that non gamers can recognize.
The game play was eons ahead ANYTHING in the market had. It DEFINED side scrolling games. Before this, there were just endless levels of the same repetitive drones with added difficulty.
It has commonly been regarded as the game that saved the video game industry back when Atari and Coleco were spewing mindless amount of games and endless amount of system upgrades. Can u name a game that has sincerely saved the video game industry? When u can, then u have an argument.
Until then, Super Mario Bros will remain the best video game of all time.

[Mochan]

Just because you save the industry doesn't make you the best game. It may make you the most influential game (and then not really) or maybe more to the point it may make you the most important game (though that is still debatable).

There were tons of contemporaries alongside Super Mario that I regard as way, way better, and enjoyed far more.

[GameLegend]

Just because you save the industry doesn't make you the best game. It may make you the most influential game (and then not really) or maybe more to the point it may make you the most important game (though that is still debatable).

There were tons of contemporaries alongside Super Mario that I regard as way, way better, and enjoyed far more.


U know what i was wrong...I was wrong to mention earlier that Super Mario Bros defined 2d side scrolling games. As IGN put it Super Mario Brothers defined " not only set the standard for 2D side-scrollers, but for video games in general: gameplay that is demanding but not frustrating, pixel-perfect controls, inspired level design and a musical score that, to this day, remains synonymous with video games."

Before you comment again about how Super Mario Brothers is undeserving of that this title, can u sit down and think. Really think about all the games that were released on pc/console the year of, the years before and after Super Mario Brothers was released and please compare to me how any other game at the time beat it in gameplay, music, graphics and controls. You cant. In north America it also came with a freak'n mini game: Duck hunt.I dont need to say anything about duck hunt.

The game ended the two year slump of video game sales in the United States after the video game crash of 1983

I really got the idea of how significant this game was when i read this quote, because it illustrates how this game is completely different than the rest of the games and how those games were:
"Before I ever played Super Mario Bros., I remember my friend telling me all about the arcade game and it just didn't seem possible. He talked about shooting fireballs, secret tunnels, bullets you could bounce off of, hidden beanstalks leading into the clouds--all these amazing, crazy things that I just couldn't imagine all fitting into one game. At a time when you could sum up most games in 30 seconds, he went on and on like this for 30 minutes; I could tell he was getting excited to play it again just talking about it. When I finally saw the game, I was...I'm not sure how to put it. Awestruck, I guess. Not only was everything my friend said true, he had barely scratched the surface."
--EGM Executive Editor Mark MacDonald

And i thought this quote was cute:
"I still clearly remember church Sunday school the day after I got my NES back in 1986. Our teacher made each kid announce aloud something in their life that they thanked God for. Of course, I thanked God for Super Mario Bros. with the utmost sincerity. It was the game that redefined the concept of gameplay: If you stop and really evaluate what's going on with Super Mario Bros.' control--the precision jumping, the sense of inertia, the depth of mastery--it's mind-blowing."
--1UP Previews Editor Shane Bettenhausen

Can u name a game that beats Super Mario brothers? That saved the video game industry? That was eons ahead of any other game at its time? That defined not only a genre but gaming itself?

[silversparrow]

Can u name a game that beats Super Mario brothers? That saved the video game industry? That was eons ahead of any other game at its time? That defined not only a genre but gaming itself?
You're still talking about the game's influence rather than its mechanics or content.

I have the same issue with people who say Citizen Kane is the best movie of all time.

No one's going to deny the SMB's importance to the history of the game industry, but it's pretty debatable whether it's the best game in terms of quality compared to everything else.

I thought SMB3 and SMW eclipsed SMB.

[Cuddly Knife]

You're still talking about the game's influence rather than its mechanics or content.
" not only set the standard for 2D side-scrollers, but for video games in general: gameplay that is demanding but not frustrating, pixel-perfect controls, inspired level design and a musical score that, to this day, remains synonymous with video games."

No one's going to deny the SMB's importance to the history of the game industry, but it's pretty debatable whether it's the best game in terms of quality compared to everything else.

I thought SMB3 and SMW eclipsed SMB. But really, they were simply extensions of the mechanics already created by SMB. SMB was the beginning of all things to come.

[GameLegend]

You're still talking about the game's influence rather than its mechanics or content.

I have the same issue with people who say Citizen Kane is the best movie of all time.

No one's going to deny the SMB's importance to the history of the game industry, but it's pretty debatable whether it's the best game in terms of quality compared to everything else.

I thought SMB3 and SMW eclipsed SMB.

Okay; I see what you are saying.

But, did anyone mention the criteria for 'best game'? So are silversparrow and Mochan saying that the best game is not important? A best game is not suppose to be influential? What defines a best game Silversparrow and Mochan?

Another point to take note is, we cant compare Halo to Doom as they were made 2 different time periods. The same goes for Super Mario Brothers. If we are going to compare super mario bros, it can only be compared to games of its time. The worst of game 2007 will have better graphics than Super Mario Brothers.

With that in note, I keep asking u guys to a name a game during Super Mario Brothers period, that that better game mechanics, content, graphics music as Super Mario Brother. Still waiting for an answer...

"There were tons of contemporaries alongside Super Mario that I regard as way, way better, and enjoyed far more."

[GameLegend]

You're still talking about the game's influence rather than its mechanics or content.


Clearly u didnt read my entire post.

[Mochan]

As IGN put it Super Mario Brothers defined " not only set the standard for 2D side-scrollers, but for video games in general: gameplay that is demanding but not frustrating, pixel-perfect controls, inspired level design and a musical score that, to this day, remains synonymous with video games."

That's bollocks. Lode Runner had gameplay that was demanding but not frustrating, pixel perfect controls, extremely inspired level design though I admit the musical score was not quite there but how many people do you know today who hear the word "videogame" today and suddenly start singing "Let's do the Mario! Swing your arms from side to side...."




Quote:
Originally Posted by Mochan
Just because you save the industry doesn't make you the best game. It may make you the most influential game (and then not really) or maybe more to the point it may make you the most important game (though that is still debatable).

There were tons of contemporaries alongside Super Mario that I regard as way, way better, and enjoyed far more.


U know what i was wrong...I was wrong to mention earlier that Super Mario Bros defined 2d side scrolling games. As IGN put it Super Mario Brothers defined " not only set the standard for 2D side-scrollers, but for video games in general: gameplay that is demanding but not frustrating, pixel-perfect controls, inspired level design and a musical score that, to this day, remains synonymous with video games."


Before you comment again about how Super Mario Brothers is undeserving of that this title, can u sit down and think. Really think about all the games that were released on pc/console the year of, the years before and after Super Mario Brothers was released and please compare to me how any other game at the time beat it in gameplay, music, graphics and controls. You cant.

Bull**** Rockman, Castlevania, pissed on Super Mario in gameplay, music, graphics and controls not to mention storyline and personality of its characters. Rockman in particular had gameplay heads and shoulders above ANYTHING at the time and the uniqueness of its music for every stage was heads and shoulders above what Super Mario had. The creepy tones from Castelvania did far more than what Super Mario's clunky tunes did. Its visuals evoked a horrifying experience at the time that Super Mario's underground levels never had.

Contra gave us a co-op experience that was clearly the best at the time and no gameplay in Mario could beat that.

Ninja Gaiden then takes Mario to town on the story front and steps on it like soiled bubblegum though I'll admit that's straying a few years too many later down the lie.

Prior to Mario I recall some games that were just too awesome like Below the Root, a really expansive adventure game that was way ahead of its time. I will admit the graphics/music/etal were bad but Below the Root had gameplay that was more on the level of Zelda 2: The Adventure of Link -- not the same but the expansiveness was there. Not bad for a game 1 year Super Mario's senior.

And Duck Hunt did not "come" with Super Mario it was a separate game, sold seperately to the rest of the world. Don't try to give Super Mario plus points by saying it and Duck Hunt were one product.

I could go on forever with a list of games on the Famicom alone that I found superior to Super Mario in terms of its gameplay/controls and you could include graphics and music there as well.

Can u name a game that beats Super Mario brothers? That saved the video game industry? That was eons ahead of any other game at its time? That defined not only a genre but gaming itself?

Super Mario surely saved the video game industry, but you'd be nothing but a tool if you really think it was aeons ahead of any other game at its time. It did not define gaming except to the poor sods praising The Lord God Hallelujah for giving us Super Mario Brothers. That's worse than the "Video game junkie" Gadfly is positing, that's the Video Game Cultist who swears Mario is his light, wears blue trousers to bed and grew a mustache when he was in 4th grade.

Define gaming itself? What are all games today 2D platformers? No? Yeah funny I thought we were gaming in 3D these days, too. Super Mario did NOT define gaming and for many of the kiddies today, a whole new generation of video gamers, they have never even seen the game. Try again old timer.

[Mochan]

You're still talking about the game's influence rather than its mechanics or content.

I have the same issue with people who say Citizen Kane is the best movie of all time.

No one's going to deny the SMB's importance to the history of the game industry, but it's pretty debatable whether it's the best game in terms of quality compared to everything else.

I thought SMB3 and SMW eclipsed SMB.


I agree -- Super Mario Brothers was a boring game for me, but SMB3 was an excellent one and I still play it today on my friend's GBA -- and it's loaded on my DS as well.

And I still find a lot of other games around the time of Super Mario to be far better, notably Castlevania and Rockman.

[Mochan]

But really, they were simply extensions of the mechanics already created by SMB. SMB was the beginning of all things to come.

By that logic I could say SMB was simply an extension of Pong.

Did SMB's mechanics have anything to do with the stealth gameplay of the Metal Gear series? What about the multiple protagonist switches?

I can't believe there are still some loons today brainwashed into thinking that Super Mario Brothers set the foundation for all games to come. A ton of gameplay genres at the time had nothing to do with Super Mario developed on their own independent of the path Super Mario tread.

Shooter games like Gradius, Shining Force, Ikaruga et al evolved along a completely different route and have next to squat to do with Super Mario. They did not... if anything they evolved from the Space Invaders/Galaga family of games -- a lineage that clearly predates Super Mario and evolved along completely different lines.

What about all the adventure games that were all the rage in 90's, whose ancestors include King's Quest, Troll's Tale, and all the other quack adventure titles on the Apple computers like Enchanter, Spellbreaker, Lucifer's Realm, etc. Their progeny is still with us today in games like Fahrenheit, Culpa Innata and Dreamfall. These do not owe anything to Super Mario other than it saving an industry for them to prosper in.

Even newer lineages like the Wolf 3D line that spawned the glut of shooters we see today have absolutely NOTHING to do with Super Mario -- Super Mario's gameplay elements and mechanics did have a hand in the creation of these games.

I could go on but to do so would be to insult both of our intellects more than I already have, frankly.




But, did anyone mention the criteria for 'best game'? So are silversparrow and Mochan saying that the best game is not important? A best game is not suppose to be influential? What defines a best game Silversparrow and Mochan?

Best game is the one you have the most fun with. If you want to say it should be the game the most people had fun with fine, but that's clearly not what IGN was doing -- they state themselves in the preface of the list that this list was based on their personal taste.



Another point to take note is, we cant compare Halo to Doom as they were made 2 different time periods. The same goes for Super Mario Brothers. If we are going to compare super mario bros, it can only be compared to games of its time. The worst of game 2007 will have better graphics than Super Mario Brothers.


Fine by me, now I've already mentioned a few games which I definitely hold to have had far better gameplay, graphics and sound than Super Mario. Feel free to argue, I don't think you can win.

[Cuddly Knife]

By that logic I could say SMB was simply an extension of Pong.

Did SMB's mechanics have anything to do with the stealth gameplay of the Metal Gear series? What about the multiple protagonist switches? Yeah, I was talking towards sparrows comment on SMB3 and World.

[Mochan]

My bad then, I thought your argument encompassed mine as well because you said SMB was the beginning of "all" things to come.

*
By the way. errata:

"Super Mario's gameplay elements and mechanics did have a hand in the creation of these games."

This should read as "did not have a hand in the creation..."

[ceevee]

SMB was sh!te. i hated the scrolling 2d thing where i couldn't see at the far edge. i hated that game. it was laborious and unsatisfying. poorly paced and ugly. the only reason i actually played it was to impress a young girl who enjoyed watching me.. but that's beside the point :D

i agree with silversparrow's comparison with Citizen Kane, technically well crafted but WTF?! almost every influential film borrowed heavily from Orson Well's technical flair but sitting in front of a screen watching some journalist questioning and gathering information is not entertaining content. Rosebud my arse. 2 frink hours of my life wasted on the last word of a megalomaniac and it didn't raise a pique.

i could watch paint dry. but just because the paint was on the Berlin Wall doesn't make it better art than the same paintjob from the local yob. nonetheless i will not demean the significance of the calls for democracy or whatever.

influential? yes.. best ever? no... not by a long shot

[ThaMaskedGamer]

I saw this on IGN didn't even bother to see what their rankings were. Just taking a glance at things now and it is as I suspected, a cop out! They put stuff in the top 10 like Civilization, Tetris, and Super Mario, because they don't have any balls. Those are no where near the best games ever, they wouldn't even make my top 50. And I've played all three and loved all three. Hell I still play Tetris on my cell phone every now and then. But this is a joke.

In my mind in no particular order some of the games i've had the most fun with over my years of gaming would be something like this:

-Tecmo Bowl, I never played Super Tecmo Bowl someone else had mentioned, but Tecmo Bowl was just part of our life in the barracks when I was in the service.

-Diablo, just blew me away. Still some of the most fun I had gaming on the net. Still Blizzard's best game ever imo, I loved Warcraft, I wasn't crazy about Starcraft, nothing they did approached Diablo. Which also was one of the scariest games ever. I'll never forget going into that damn dungeon and facing the butcher for the first time. When I think about the impact this game had on internet gaming and how great the game was, I might very well say Diablo is the #1 game ever.

-Age of Empire and Command & Conquer, both great great games, both had significant impact of PC gaming and internet gaming, and they were just fun as hell.

-Street Fighter on SNES, again, another Army favorite. If Uncle Sam knew how much time we wasted playing this game at work, we woulda been Court Martialed. This game had great graphics, great control, and it was just crazy fun.

-Doom and Doom 2, just incredible revolutionary experiences. If you don't know the significance of Doom u just missed out!

-Half-life 1. The real precursor to modern FPS. Just took what Quake and Doom and Unreal had done a great job of, but put a fantastic story, pacing, and framing behind it. Stupid ending though.

-Castlevania....I just remember wasting so much time playing this game.

-Halo...i'll only put Halo here, because I look at Halo like I look at the Matrix. Matrix 2 was more action packed, but nothing can beat the experience of the first time u saw and heard the plot in the Matrix. Same here, Halo2 technically may have been better, but without the legwork Halo did! Anyway, just blasted the doors off the silly notion shooters can't be done well on consoles, look at where we are today! Blasted the doors off the notion a controller can't be a good controller for a FPS! Singlehandedly responsible for the mass migration of the best developers and development teams, yes PC developers, onto the consoles! Had a great story, great action! Introduced co-op storyplay(for all intents and purposes) to the PCs FPS framework! Integrated vehicules into the single player gameplay better than any game had ever come close to. Introduced GREAT AI into console games. Darn near singlehandedly loosened the deathgrip Japanese developers had over the console arena.

- Syndicate Wars...this was the COOLEST game ever. Four cyborgs under your control, u hover around the city with a birds eye view. Taking out rival gangs, enhancing your guys with freakin gatling guns! Mowing down citizens on the street, this game SH*Ts all over any GTA game! Blowing up buildings and hoping into a cool car and driving away. Blade Runner type graphics. Damn someone should do a remake of this game! Oh, the game that made me instantly put down SNES and become a PC gamer.

- Soul Calibur....really re-ignited my interest in fighter games after the Street Fighter and MK days.

- Splinter Cell, made me forget about Halo! And when Splinter Cell 2 came out, spies v. mercs online actually made me stop online racing! Spies v. Mercs I think one of the best online competitive games ever, certainly the smartest. Real stealth, real spy action, and real teamwork!

- Motogp2 on XBOX....just the sickest motorcycle simulation ever up to that point. The single player game alone was stellar, but that had been seen in Motogp1. Putting the game online with 16 players, was still to this day the best online racing I have ever seen. 16 players from around the world, we had some of the greatest races. The first year of XBOX Live and this game was probably most influential in its early success. The group of guys that kinda became a fraternity because of this game was just awesome. And I don't think any other racing experience will rival what was going on, online with Motogp back then on XBOX. I've not seen it repeated in any other online racer yet, and I hope that feeling and level of competition and fraternity can be duplicated again in an online racer.

-Rainbow6 on XBOX.....similar to Motogp, we just built a fraternity around this game. It was just an experience. And oh by the way, the game was just awesome too. Still waiting for a co-op online shooter to re-create that feeling we had in this game.

Some of the other games, Jane's AH-64 Longbow an incredible incredible game. Tron Deadly Discs on Intellivision was mindblowing back then. Mech Assault on the PC was mindblowing. Oh hell how can I forget Baldur's Gate! Hell Baldur's Gate was Lord of The Rings before the movie ever came out, the first game version of the Tolkien universe(for all intents and purposes) done well.

Anyway, I liked and played most of the classics too. I like nostalgia too. But EFF their list, the real games to me were the fun games the games that had impact, the games that dominated the industry, the games that if u missed u just missed out on something big.

It will be interesting to see where 360 and PS3 are able to add to all our lists as time goes on. I wanted to add GRAW and GOW and even COD2 to my list but I just can't really add a nextgen game just yet. Not even Forza2, which despite its technical feats, I can't put it in. Something is missing from these games. I think GOW for the first 3 chapters was a sure fire top 100 game, then the last two chapters just fizzled! GRAW if they had of filled those incredible mexican streets with traffic and people, a lock!

One thing is for sure, i've spent too much damn time in my life gaming!

[ThaMaskedGamer]

#91 Pilot Wings...a great SNES game.

#89 Alone In The Dark...can't believe I forgot about this game.

#82 Syndicate, they put my game at 82, this is a travesty. Definitely a top 20 if not top 10! This game is actually far more advanced than most games we play today! Hell, the mods, jacking vehicles, I forgot about the trains! Developers back then just had way better imaginations than they do today. Back then Syndicate, today Saint's Row and GTA, sad!

#80 Ninja Gaiden Black...I guess NG would make my top 100.

#72 Mech Warrior 2...good to know it made the list! Should be higher, definitely top 50.

#64 Total Annihilation...definitely top 100.

#59 Command and Conquer Red Alert, definitely agree with this.

#42 Baldur's Gate 2, no surprise, actually should be higher.

#22 System Shock 2, how the hell could I forget about this game, actually one i think they rated about right, should be in the top 20 but close enough.

They put a lot of crap on that list, but oh well, to each his own.

[ceevee]

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^^ so this is what saved video gaming, eh? i'd rather go to the local DIY shop and spruce up the house a bit.

and if anyone again suggests SMB was the best thing since Dawn's crack, i'd refute that with the very same argument GameLegend uses:

"Really think about all the games that were released on pc/console the year of, the years before and after Super Mario Brothers was released and please compare to me how any other game at the time beat it in gameplay, music, graphics and controls."

how about the gameplay, control and music of Megaman/Rockman
or Elite (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_%28computer_game%29)'s sheer open-ended vast world where anything was deemed possible

or the highly ambitious Tau Ceti (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tau_Ceti_%28computer_game%29) which was a lot more colourful on my Amstrad CPC 464. 3d graphics and shadows in 1985. beat that! hah!

or Jet Set Willy (http://www.mobygames.com/game/cpc/jet-set-willy) a humorous game with a humorous soundtrack (Fiddler on the Roof)

how about the RPG The Bard's Tale (http://www.mobygames.com/game/c64/tales-of-the-unknown-volume-i-the-bards-tale)

or the truly original RTS The Ancient Art of War (http://www.mobygames.com/game/ancient-art-of-war). i didn't understand this game when i was 6 but as the years went by and the releases on the Amstrad thinned i popped this into the cassette deck (hehe) and started my long running fascination with rock-papers-scissors

SMB could not hold a candle to any of the above in scope or grandeur. but SMB is the videogame equivalent to that woeful film Titanic. it sold by the bucket load. and that is it's sole claim to fame

[Gadfly2317]

i agree with silversparrow's comparison with Citizen Kane, technically well crafted but WTF?! almost every influential film borrowed heavily from Orson Well's technical flair but sitting in front of a screen watching some journalist questioning and gathering information is not entertaining content. Rosebud my arse. 2 frink hours of my life wasted on the last word of a megalomaniac and it didn't raise a pique.

i could watch paint dry. but just because the paint was on the Berlin Wall doesn't make it better art than the same paintjob from the local yob. nonetheless i will not demean the significance of the calls for democracy or whatever.

influential? yes.. best ever? no... not by a long shot

???

Wow. I think its a difficult analogy to compare Citizen Kane to Super Mario. The difference between that game and newer games, compared to Citizen Kane and newer films is not very similar.

For all the advances in the technology of film, the art of acting and story telling are not something that are necessarily better now. I'm pretty blown away by your experience of Citizen Kane. . .but its a matter of taste, not a reflection of the profundity of Citizen Kane, the power of its acting, or the literary brilliance of the script. I mean, do you like modern psychological dramas and character studies. . . films like Capote with Phillip Seymore Hoffman?

Citizen Kane would blow me away if it were released yesterday rather than 60+ years ago. Action movies, horror movies, science fiction. . . technology has made it possible for these movies to be more intense than earlier films in those genres, and I can understand how someone might not be entertained by Citizen Kane if they aren't into history, politics, psychology and the human condition. . . but I can't think of any film in its category that tops Citizen Kane. It's not just notable for being influential and old, it still has something important to say to us today.

Whereas the Mario game, and MANY old games, they might be fun, but the medium of games is so technology driven that despite my belief that older games are still fun, they are definitely exceeded to a much vaster degree than new films exceed old ones.

[ceevee]

???

Wow. I think its a difficult analogy to compare Citizen Kane to Super Mario. The difference between that game and newer games, compared to Citizen Kane and newer films is not very similar.

lol Gadfly, talk about spotting an improbable analogy and understatement.. why bother toshing about Citizen Kane's profundity when i compared a videogame to a brick wall.. you may have gone overboard with the psychology and the human condition analysis

[Glockstar]

That was the cool thing about our list: we didn't try to weigh in any world views, do any empathizing, or consider how influential a game was; we just ranked 'em according to our own personal likes and dislikes and personal experiences and that's it.


That said, some of you guys' dissing Super Mario Bros. number one-ness... you're on crack. No it's not my favorite game of all-time nor would it get my vote for most "influential" or "historically important"... but it was still a great game, and was enjoyed by billions, and was influential, and was historically important... and I recognize that.

And I'm pretty sure that's what IGN was doing. (As do all sites when they do their Top 100.) These comprehensive lists always look at the big picture. You have to.

Or risk your list - and your credibility - getting laughed off the face of the earth.

Get over yourselves! You can maybe argue that it's not number one - that's it number two or three... but you go lower than that and you're being retarded.

[ilnadmy]

It's weird how every "Top X" list for videogames has some Nintendo game as #1. Either one of the Mario games or Zelda Ocarina of Time. I don't know who decided that OoT is the best game ever made, but that seems to be a highly-held opinion.

[BaneNWN]

That list lost all credibility when halo was ranked higher then UT 2004.Makes me sick to my stomach at how much halo took from the UT series and made it suckier and it gets rated higher.This list seems more like a popularity list then anything.I enjoyed DOOM 3 myself but has no buiness in the top 20.I think Deus X is a top 10 game to and thats rated way to low.

[Gadfly2317]

It's weird how every "Top X" list for videogames has some Nintendo game as #1. Either one of the Mario games or Zelda Ocarina of Time. I don't know who decided that OoT is the best game ever made, but that seems to be a highly-held opinion.

If I were comparing a game to Citizen Kane, it would be Ocarina. As far as film analogies, going back earlier stuff like Super Mario would be like the silent era of film. Of course, Zelda doesn't have voice acting, but anyway. . . .

And Ceevee. . . going overboard. . . .ME???? :D

[BaneNWN]

It's weird how every "Top X" list for videogames has some Nintendo game as #1. Either one of the Mario games or Zelda Ocarina of Time. I don't know who decided that OoT is the best game ever made, but that seems to be a highly-held opinion.

Ya OoT was awesome i wont argue it being in the top 5.It really took my breath away the first time i played through it,it just did everything well

[Cuddly Knife]

It's weird how every "Top X" list for videogames has some Nintendo game as #1. Either one of the Mario games or Zelda Ocarina of Time. I don't know who decided that OoT is the best game ever made, but that seems to be a highly-held opinion.
Well, it's simple to answer this post. Nintendo is simply the greatest video game developer in the world. No one has pushed more boundries, broken more barriers, and straight-up influenced more aspects of gaming like Nintendo.

Can anyone argue against that statement?

[ilnadmy]

I won't argue against that Cuddly, but even then is it necessary that the greatest developer in the world created the best game in the world? I don't think so. They might have a larger number of their games in the upper part of the list, but I don't think it's necessary that they grab the #1 spot every time. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind that they occupy the #1 spot most of the time, as it's well-deserved, I'm just saying does this always have to be the case?

[Cuddly Knife]

Well, if these games were considered the greatest of all time at one point, why should that change now, when there obviously isn't a game that has had that original impact? Really, the only game I can think of recently would be GTA3. I'm mainly trying to think of games that have had the most general influence on other games, whether in the same genre or not.

[ilnadmy]

When I think of a list called "Top 100 Games of All Time", I'm not thinking about which game was most influential, but which game I enjoyed the most. I don't play games because I think it's going to influence future games. That's stupid. I play games to have fun. So for me, a top 100 list should have the top 100 games that you actually enjoyed.

[T.Tashi]

Well, it's simple to answer this post. Nintendo is simply the greatest video game developer in the world. No one has pushed more boundries, broken more barriers, and straight-up influenced more aspects of gaming like Nintendo.

Can anyone argue against that statement?

I wouldn't argue it but Nintendo was a game and toy company long before it was a "video game" company. Those roots give it a distinct advantage over Sony and MS. I'd put them in the same category as Parker Brothers and Milton Bradley. So are they the greatest game company in the world? I wouldn't argue against that either. Amist all the technology, they seemed to always maintained a quality emphasis on gameplay.

[Cuddly Knife]

When I think of a list called "Top 100 Games of All Time", I'm not thinking about which game was most influential, but which game I enjoyed the most. I don't play games because I think it's going to influence future games. That's stupid. I play games to have fun. So for me, a top 100 list should have the top 100 games that you actually enjoyed.
Yeah, that's also what Glock was saying about our lists, but when you're a big assed site like IGN, you can't just list your personal faves. You have to take in all other aspects of what the game has done for the individual, as well as the greater good.

[T.Tashi]

???

Wow. I think its a difficult analogy to compare Citizen Kane to Super Mario. The difference between that game and newer games, compared to Citizen Kane and newer films is not very similar.

For all the advances in the technology of film, the art of acting and story telling are not something that are necessarily better now. I'm pretty blown away by your experience of Citizen Kane. . .but its a matter of taste, not a reflection of the profundity of Citizen Kane, the power of its acting, or the literary brilliance of the script. I mean, do you like modern psychological dramas and character studies. . . films like Capote with Phillip Seymore Hoffman?

Citizen Kane would blow me away if it were released yesterday rather than 60+ years ago. Action movies, horror movies, science fiction. . . technology has made it possible for these movies to be more intense than earlier films in those genres, and I can understand how someone might not be entertained by Citizen Kane if they aren't into history, politics, psychology and the human condition. . . but I can't think of any film in its category that tops Citizen Kane. It's not just notable for being influential and old, it still has something important to say to us today.

Whereas the Mario game, and MANY old games, they might be fun, but the medium of games is so technology driven that despite my belief that older games are still fun, they are definitely exceeded to a much vaster degree than new films exceed old ones.

That's probably why Roger Ebert maintains that video games is not art. Citizen Kane is still the standard by which all films are measured, and comparatively, videogame has no real Citizen Kane... yet. I'm not saying Ebert is right. I think he's rather pompous and gets way too much credit as a critic. But I do see where he's coming from.

[ilnadmy]

I don't. Why do you need to compare every movie to Citizen Kane? What point does that serve? It just solidifies the idea that there is a "perfect movie" that every movie should strive to emulate, or at least live up to. F*** that, I say. We're all different, we all have our personal preferences. Not everyone wants movies like Citizen Kane, and not everyone wants it to be seen as the "standard by which all films are measured".

[silversparrow]

If I were comparing a game to Citizen Kane, it would be Ocarina. As far as film analogies, going back earlier stuff like Super Mario would be like the silent era of film. Of course, Zelda doesn't have voice acting, but anyway. . . .

You're right, I retract what I said about Citizen Kane. Ocarina of Time is more analogous to that movie in that it's widely considered the standard to which all games are compared (in terms of quality).

That would leave SMB and Tetris analogous to Metropolis and Nosferatu. :D

[GameLegend]

Okay. I just finished writing my Organic Chemistry exam.
Now, i'm back. And a lot of **** has been discussed since then. So much i want to say and refute.

First of all. I think i went a bit overboard with comparing games released AFTER SMB. To tell you guys the truth, I can think of MANY games released AFTER Super Mario Bros that were better. One of my favourites was Super Contra 2 for the NES.

So, u may ask: Why the hell does GameLegend still hype over SMB?

Well, look at ALLLL the games before Super Mario Bros, that were released of the year OF Super Mario Bros and the years before. No game at that time could match super mario bros. I believe, in order to compare a game, one must compare the game to the rest of the competition. This game was Leaps ahead of all the competition: Graphically, musically, gameplay wise. So, the best game of all time should be the one that creates the biggest gap of superiority. This gap was major. Before this game, we all had the same gameplay repeated in every levels, with mind numbling identical spirts over and over.


Thats what i should have emphasized, but got way off track and way overboard on Super Mario Bros pimpage.

So what game do u believe created the largest gap of superiority in gameplay.

[Cuddly Knife]

So what game do u believe created the largest gap of superiority in gameplay.
I don't know if I can name the game that started it all(Mario64 is the most well-known for basically perfecting), but I'd have to mention the jump from 2-D to 3-D.

Or, I'd have to throw a shout to GTA3, who pretty much made sandbox the standard for gaming nowadays. Before, no one was doing it, now almost every game wants some kind of the same type of freedom.

[Mochan]

One of my favourites was Super Contra 2 for the NES.

Never heard of it. I don't think such a game exists.

First of all. I think i went a bit overboard with comparing games released AFTER SMB.

Translation: "Sorry I got owned let me backtrack and say something else."


Well, look at ALLLL the games before Super Mario Bros, that were released of the year OF Super Mario Bros and the years before. No game at that time could match super mario bros.

In your dreams. As I mentioned already, Below the Root came before SMB and had a scope way larger than SMB, with far more complexity and an actual plot.

Elite - this was a 3D sandbox game in 1984.
Ancient Art of War - also 1984, real strategy game ahead of its time
Below the Root - 1984, sprawling platforming adventure game with a huge gameworld
King's Quest - 1984 not exactly mindbumingly identical sprites over and over now is it?


So, the best game of all time should be the one that creates the biggest gap of superiority. This gap was major. Before this game, we all had the same gameplay repeated in every levels, with mind numbling identical spirts over and over.

Elite came a year before SMB and had 3D graphics. Where's this gap you're talking about again?



As for the biggest gap of superiority in gameplay I would agree with Cuddly that the jump from 2D to 3D created a far larger gap than whatever SMB did. Even "virtual 3D" Wolftenstein 3D created a huge gap and really nothing before it had anything that compared. Super Mario 64 was predated by just a day by the original Quake, which I believe was the first "true" 3D game but don't quote me on that. Quake I believe was also the first Internet-playable game.

I don't know what created the biggest gap per se right now, it's a very hard question to answer, but I am sure that I wouldn't give the crown to Super Mario. I would argue that the gap from Pong to, say, Donkey Kong was far bigger than the "gap" between Super Mario and any of those wonderful 1984 games I posted.



Or, I'd have to throw a shout to GTA3, who pretty much made sandbox the standard for gaming nowadays. Before, no one was doing it, now almost every game wants some kind of the same type of freedom.

I wouldn't say no one was doing it. There were tons of sandbox games before GTA3 hit the scene, like the Elder Scrolls and the afore-mentioned Elite (which spawned lots of progeny like Privateer, X and Squadron Commander, and of course Sim City though I realize that is a different type of sandbox from what you are describing. GTA3 did popularize it though, I will drink to that.

I would also vehemently deny saying sandbox has become a standard in today's games. Plenty of big games today don't do sandbox, like Halo 3, Gears of War and Call of Duty 4 to name a few.

I actually think it's easier to name games today that don't have sandbox than it is to name games that do.

[ilnadmy]

I would actually dock GTA3 points for bringing the whole sandbox craze to games because developers had a tendency to stick this sandbox bullsh** in games that had no place being sandbox-y. The Jak series went downhill fast with their insistence on sandboxing it, which annoyed the hell out of me as I loved the first game. I don't really like sandbox games, so sticking this function into every game out there makes me sick inside.

[Rogue Bounty Hunter]

The Jak series went downhill fast with their insistence on sandboxing it, which annoyed the hell out of me as I loved the first game.

I agree. Jak & Daxter was great, but the next two were awful, IMO. Jak II was frustrating, and Jak III just felt like the devs lost their focus. I always thought the character design of J&D were better than Ratchet & Clank, so if Naughty Dog decides to resurrect the series, I would keep an eye on it.

As far as sandbox games overall, I enjoy them if done right. The GTA series is enjoyable, but I always felt that Mercenaries was the best sandbox game made so far. There wasn't a bunch of fluff in the game that felt unnecessary, unlike some of the stuff in GTA. Dead Rising would have been a fun sandbox game, but the devs botched it up with the time limits and restraints on the main missions....and the lame main character.

[Cuddly Knife]

Dead Rising owned your zombie soul!! I mean, people can't hold out against zombies forever, can they?

Frank was a boner, though.

[NEO-360]

Nor is Halo. Personally, generic FPS wanna be should probably get left out the top 100, imo. .

But yet you loved the game Folken ole buddy. Everything else you said? Garbage.

Spoken like a true jackass. Why dont you call Halo by its rightful name:Franchise.:thumbsup:

Halo IMO should've been listed higher on the list. Thats for sure.

[ilnadmy]

Mary-Kate and Ashley is a franchise too, Neo. I hear they have a new game: Mary-Kate and Ashley Stick Their Feet in their Mouths. Seems right up your alley.